You guys.
You guuuuuuys.
This really crazy thing happened when I outed myself on my blog, and I’m not sure if you noticed, but it blew up everywhere, and now it feels like my life will never be the same.
Let me just take you through a few of the new experiences that have happened since Friday and a couple of the funny moments.
First, on Friday when things started spreading and spreading and we realized suddenly that not only would our friends and family know I am gay, but pretty much everyone in the whole dang state of Utah and beyond, we got a call from Gawker.com. Gawker.com!
Now, when you get a call from someone at Gawker.com, you should probably not do what I did, which was stutter and speak so haltingly that the poor guy who wanted to reprint your blog post literally thought his phone was cutting out. He was like “Oh, I’m so sorry, I get horrible reception here in my apartment.”
Yeah, Mr. Gawker Writer. That’s what’s happening. You have bad reception. It’s definitely not that my hand is shaking as I hold the phone and my brain is so overwhelmed by IAMGOINGTOBEREPRINTEDONGAWKER that I sound like I have a mix of turrets and dementia. Perhaps you should switch cell-phone carriers, even. Or next time call someone that can actually have a telephone conversation. Either one.
But that wasn’t the worst phone call. (This was before we had Lolly take over the phone duties, because she is better at not sounding like an idiot than me on the phone.) And granted, I had a reason to be FREAKING OUT because as I was working out in the hotel’s fitness center I got a call from New York and I was being asked about appearing on a national TV show. A big one. (Not finalized, we’ll see if it happens. Looks like it probably will.)
But here’s the thing about me: as the above example demonstrates, I completely suck at talking on the phone. I’m always running over people’s sentences and saying weird crap and talking at all the wrong moments and laughing at inappropriate things. The conversation with this guy went pretty well overall, but then as the call was winding down, I failed to realize that the call was coming to a close, and so in the precise moment that he said the word “goodbye” I spastically blurted something like “Because the thing I really want to communicate is that love is the clarion call of our post and what we hope to help share with the world…”
Really Weed? Phone etiquette 101 says “at this point, you cordially say ‘goodbye’ to the recipient of your telephonic communication.” Yet instead of that, you decide to utter the cheesiest, most hippy-sounding sentence you may have ever said in your life. AS he’s saying goodbye. And then you sit there awkwardly, hoping he’ll pick up the conversation. And he doesn’t.
Awesome.
Oh well.
Oh, also, it’s really interesting to have a post with nearly 3,000 comments, most of which are breathtakingly poignant. So, so many of them are absolutely beautiful–people pouring out their hearts and souls and sharing deep and meaningful things–things that sometimes make Lolly and me tear up with the bigness of what’s happening. We’ll be reading through, holding hands, tearing up and feeling so much love and joy and gratitude, and then we get to a comment that’s like “Hey satan, why don’t you stop being all satanic and torturing kittens for fun and eating spider sandwiches because you like the taste. Oh and I HATE you.” and it’s really jarring. Like, it’s just so incredibly incongruent. “Rainbows, unicorns, flowers, lambs, DECAPITATED BABY, clouds, sunshine.” <——— It’s kind of like that.
We have decided to not take these comments personally and to really heed what the post originally said. It’s okay. It’s okay to feel strong feelings. Seriously. We get it. And we love you anyway. And actually mean that.
In closing a couple of photos:
And, later today, our vacation ends and we go back home to see the girls. The three girls at home who have no idea whatsoever what just happened. Who have no idea that their picture has been seen by hundreds of thousands–if not millions–of people. Three girls who will hug us and say “what did you bring us???” and be sweet and thrilled and hyper and beautiful, and who have no idea that their mommy and daddy just had something happen that will change the lives of all of us, probably forever.
This brings us to the first question we want to answer, and it’s a really good one. (We’ll try to answer one of the common questions we get in every post.)
What about your girls? When will you tell them?
This is such a good question, and one that we have thought about a lot. It was with great trepidation about them that we went forward with this information, and we fully recognize that we have changed their lives by being public about ours. Our hope is that this stuff will have minimal impact on them, and that people will never judge them or treat them differently because their dad is gay. But you never know. One thing is for certain, our focus in any difficult moment that arises will be to help them process their emotions appropriately, and use difficult circumstances to help them learn life lessons about loving others, being charitable, and forgiving anyone who judges or criticizes. As Brene Brown says, “kids are wired for struggle.” (That quote is coming from my memory. Sorry if it’s a little off.) We can’t protect them from struggle, but we can be a pillar of support and strength, no matter what they’re facing. And this issue will be no exception.
As far as telling them about my homosexuality, my gut as well as my training as a therapist tells me that eight years old is probably the developmental age to talk to them about sexuality and sex. So I would imagine that letting them know about this might be part of that conversation. We’re going to have to see. I do know, for certain, that our oldest will want to know as early as possible. She is incredibly curious about interpersonal information (as you can see here), and I am positive that finding out as a late teen (which is probably impossible now–let’s face it, Google will still exist then) would be really traumatizing for her, and she would probably feel very betrayed that we hadn’t been more open with her. The other girls aren’t old enough to get a read on.
As with all parenting decisions, we’ll be following our instincts, following the spirit, and waiting for the perfect moment as we play it by ear, responding appropriately to their cues. But our stance is one of openness and love. We want to model the kind of communication we hope they feel able to have with us so that our girls grow up knowing that in the Weed household, we are allowed to talk about hard things, and then we process them together, and then we love each other. Vulnerability, openness, honesty and love are better than secrecy, shame, fear and ignorance every time, at least in my book.
I am so happy that you exist.
me too:)
Amen to that!!! Me too!
My thoughts exactly:-))))
Agreed! Josh, Thank you for your message from the other day. This is a big topic right now and though I know you have a lot of support, I wanted to add mine and to leave this message of unconditional love for anyone who reads your post, but is suffering:
Compassion & Controversy: A Message for Unconditional Love
Thank you so much for sharing this post. I live with my father and his partner and I love them both deeply. I found out when I was 21 that my father was bisexual and had chosen a homosexual lifestyle. I didn't feel betrayed but It was spiritually challenging. It causes you to question your own sexuality throughout your life and some of my other siblings have expressed the same sentiment though it seems illogical. You kind of wonder….if my dad is gay…am I. My sister asked me one day about how to tell her children and how I would choose to handle it if I had children of my own. I just really agreed with what one of the apostles said like two conferences ago. he said " talk to your children about sex. Talk about it often." I think it is best to explain it to children early. I often think it is sad that so many people don't talk about sex with their kids because they are uncomfortable, because the sad part is they are learning it from everyone else. And honestly when I look back I wondered if my dad was participating in homosexuality wasy before I was even a teenager because he was often hanging around that crowd and other people talked about it. Kids are so not stupid. They not be able to express it in words but the subtle non-verbals are very clear. I love the idea of talking about when kids are 8…but honestly I think they will wonder before then. Not telling you what to do. I definitely think every situation is different but those are my thoughts for what its world.
Exactly how I feel! This blog is a blessing to many people.
Me too! I can't read others' posts because I get very defensive. I'm obviously not as Christ like as I should be, but I'll just pass on reading the other comments, and choose to be positive and uplifting!
I have a question and it'd get lost in all the other comments if I commented on your other post again. But I had some insight thanks to you, posted it on my blog, then had a couple of stewing. And do you honestly think someone can change their sexual orientation I guess? It's been gnawing at me because even though your message has tons of hope in it, I don't so much. I'm not sure I could ever achieve what you two beautiful people did. I son't know…I start feeling really defeated because I can't imagine that's even possible
http://fireflypromise.blogspot.com/
I don't hear Josh saying that he's changing his sexual orientation. He seems to be making choices to determine his behavior, though, and some of those choices are contrary to his sexual orientation.
No but I want to. He certainly doesn't need to
Sorry I should've clarified. I am also dealing with SSA and my problem is his story is the exception, and I don't think I'd ever get what he has. At first when I read his post I was like "Whoa! I could make it work!" Then during the next few days I got some sense and realized he is the anomaly and I was dreaming. So that's why I just want to know if he thinks it's possible to change something like THAT. He's been going through with this for decades while I've only been trying to hide it for a few years.
So am I just supposed to bear it or is it possible to change it? Have you tried and failed? Or just accepted yourself as you are? I can't imagine Heavenly Father doing this to people (saying at the same time it's unnatural) and thus making it inborn and and irreversible, but I sure didn't choose it.
He is not the anomaly. And he doesn't want to change his same-sex attraction. He plays with it, he pokes fun with it, he shares it in an extremely appropriate ways, he thinks about it, he lives with it every single moment to the fullest.
He is not the anomaly, because I try to be like him and probably tens if not hundreds of thousands of silent Unicorns like him around the world. We are just not very loud. But that would likely to change. Thanks to him. He is my hero. Thank you, Josh.
One Small Flame, I hope that you can find some answers and some hope.
Josh Weed, is there an online forum that you'd recommend for faithful lds people dealing with ssa? I was married to a bisexual (I think he was bi not gay–honesty was never one of his strong points) man. Our marriage was pretty good for a number of years, even after I found out about his ssa. It was when he began deceiving me again that things went south in our marriage.
I wouldn't mind giving a little encouragement to those who are in or have a desire for a faithful lds marriage where ssa is a factor, if there was a good online forum for that.
I've encouraged Josh to create a new place like the one you would like him to recommend, and brand it with his name.
For obvious reasons, it would take some time for him to respond to that idea, but I can't see any other way how this thing could unfold in a long run, if Josh remains true to himself (and he will).
We just need to be slightly patient.
We know scriptures and church Doctrine speak of both Divine Nature and Natural Man. To which is it unnatural? God gave us both, but we are to overcome the natural man, and allow our Divine Natures to fill our life. Overcome doesn't mean to change what was Divinely Created or intended, it just means that we have to be in control of it (which is a learning process) and use it only for the purposes which God has for it. I don't think that Josh Weed is the exception to the rule because he is Homosexual and satisfied with his marriage and hetero-oriented sex life, I think those kind of miracles of finding the perfect spouse and happiness are extended to many (maybe not all, not all straight people get to find happiness in a marriage in this life, but many and most do have that available to them), I think the real exception to the rule would be if ever God has changed the sexual orientation of someone. Would I rather have the blessing of being straight, or the blessing of being in a happy marriage and enjoying all of the blessings of the gospel of Jesus Christ? I think the second blessing is better, and the one that I would choose. You have to trust in God that He knows what He is doing with your life, and just have hope. My favorite scripture to apply to my life is the scripture that if you have no more than a desire to believe something, let that desire work in you, and then you will have place to believe it. It's how I gained self confidence and a love of myself through my own personal struggles in this life. It's okay to be who you are, there is still place for you in His church, after all, He made you who you are, and brought you to His church, so obviously His plan is at work here.
*I don't think that it is the path of EVERY SSA-ed person (Christian or otherwise) to be married to a member of the opposite sex, but it sounds like it's something that you want, and I as my PERSONAL OPINION suggest that I think that Heavenly Father would be very happy to bless those with those opportunities as they seek them. Just to clarify, I wrote too much and it got a little jumbled.
One Small Flame, Here is a message of unconditional love for you: http://reasonable-thought.blogspot.com/2012/06/compassion-controversy-message-for.html
I think it's been stated that he is still very gay and very attracted to men. He doesnt seem to think it is something that can be changed, but he doesn't let it define him and was able to connect with Lolly on a much deeper level than physical attraction.
I have a similar background: I'm LDS, I'm attracted to other women and always have been (my first crush was to a girl named Miriam in first grade), and I've never felt ashamed or evil because of it. I knew the doctrine of the church though, and it made sense to me. I believed in it fully, and therefore never planned on marrying in this life (which though was a little sad didn't weigh me down too much and I made plans for law school to be a children's advocate in the courtroom). Then I met G. We became fast friends. I talked to him about everything. We were very connected spiritually, mentally, and emotionally. Although I never was attracted to him sexually, I grew to love him very deeply. We were married in the mt. Timp temple and have been together for seven years now. We have two children that we love beyond measure. I still struggle with SSA, I imagineI always will, but I have a satisfying and committed heterosexual marriage. Its made me feel more happy and fullfilled than anything else in this life. Unlike Josh the only person who knows about my orientation is my husband and The Lord (I just don't feel like its anyone's business but ours-though what Josh and Lolly are doing is very courageous and has helped many). I might tell my children someday when they are older, but well have to see.
I think it's been stated that he is still very gay and very attracted to men. He doesnt seem to think it is something that can be changed, but he doesn't let it define him and was able to connect with Lolly on a much deeper level than physical attraction.
I have a similar background: I'm LDS, I'm attracted to other women and always have been (my first crush was to a girl named Miriam in first grade), and I've never felt ashamed or evil because of it. I knew the doctrine of the church though, and it made sense to me. I believed in it fully, and therefore never planned on marrying in this life (which though was a little sad didn't weigh me down too much and I made plans for law school to be a children's advocate in the courtroom). Then I met G. We became fast friends. I talked to him about everything. We were very connected spiritually, mentally, and emotionally. Although I never was attracted to him sexually, I grew to love him very deeply. We were married in the mt. Timp temple and have been together for seven years now. We have two children that we love beyond measure. I still struggle with SSA, I imagineI always will, but I have a satisfying and committed heterosexual marriage. Its made me feel more happy and fullfilled than anything else in this life. Unlike Josh the only person who knows about my orientation is my husband and The Lord (I just don't feel like its anyone's business but ours-though what Josh and Lolly are doing is very courageous and has helped many). I might tell my children someday when they are older, but well have to see.
You guys are great, such a beautiful family. 🙂 It's sad that there are so many intolerant people on both sides of this debate. Keep the faith, my brother. And keep up the great work.
Sorry to be one of the "dead baby" and not "fluffy bunny" commentors…but here it is… Right from the get go, I worried that you'd "come out" for the 15 minutes of fame it would bring you…the timing seems too perfect, what with Ty Mansfield on the cover of LDS whatever. It gives me pause to wonder "WHY"? Why now? You're obviously excited about all of the publicity, shaking and all, but why? If this is such a spiritual, sacred experience for you…why go all weak in the knee's for Gawker.com. WHO CARES??? Oh, that's right…YOU DO! I'm sincerely afraid you are going to regret this terribly. If you haven't already, look up Carol Lynn Pearson's daughter, Emily's blog. Let's pray that Anna, Tessa and Viva don't become "Emily's". Sad day Weed, sad, sad day. You may now all commence with the comment bashing…I could give a________.
it's so hard to take someone at face value based on what you read or what they say on the internet. There are so many examples of people being deceptive, immoral, or counterfeit. But, I choose to try and see it from the innocent viewpoint. Josh and his wife feel that they have something very rare. In a time when hatred, bullying, and strife is plaguing our society they have a voice of peace and love. If they "want the attention" that's fine. But, no matter the reasoning, the benefit remains. If 1 person reads the blog and feels better about themselves, it's a victory.
I agree with this answer most of all. To me, it doesn't feel like he's doing this for the attention, or the money or whatever else the other anon comment mentioned or thought of mentioning. I choose to see it as something that they needed to share to help other people that might be going through so much pain because of this issue. Thank you for sharing Weed. I look forward to hearing more.
Sounds like a huge publicity stunt…guess what it worked. I'm gonna write a blog about remembering when I first knew I was heterosexual.
Anonymous (the one who feels Josh and Lolly are looking for attention), you seem to have much bitterness in your heart – at least that is what is coming out from your comments. That's got to be a painful way to live life. I'm sorry. I know both Josh and Lolly's families and have worked with Josh before when he would not even allow others to know who he really was. I can tell you that neither Josh or Lolly want fame or attention. However, as is evident from the nearly 3000 comments so far – of which I've read over 2000 myself – their story is making a world of difference to many many people – on all sides of this issue. As a priesthood leader who has worked with many many people for whom SSA is real – I can tell you from the experience of trying to love and help these wonderful sons and daughters of God, Josh and Lolly being willing to share their experience is beyond helpful – it will save lives. FWIW
Josh, you fly squarely in the teeth to every single conventional wisdom one can possibly conceive, which is soothing and pleasing to those who sincerely look for answers, while disquieting and disturbing to those who do not.
And that is true for anyone, no matter the side of homosexual or heterosexual fence they are in.
Man, if you didn't exist, you should have been created from scratch.
Yes. Consider instead that they have been prayful and led by the Spirit up to this point, and will probably continue to do the same. It isn't impossible that God would want them to share their story with a broader audience. It is really not the place of any person to judge any other person, but it is our place to consider our own lives and seek inspiration for what we do ourselves. Thanks, Weed, for very carefully reiterating these principles over and over again.
Great! And if you can even come close to the love and inspiration that these two have brought, you deserve all the publicity in the world. So do they!
First, it's possible to do something like this for altruistic reasons (e.g. wanting to open up the dialogue and benefit others), and still be excited and nervous and anxious about the resulting publicity. Knowing Josh and Lolly, I suspect that's the case here. Enjoying one's fifteen minutes of fame does not make one a glory hound.
Second, to give some perspective to those who think Josh and Lolly have ruined their kids' lives: Fifteen minutes of fame is just that. Don't get me wrong, I believe that their contribution to an open discussion will have lasting effects, but I don't believe that five years from now random strangers are going to be throwing rocks at their car while they drive their daughters to school. The people who love the Weeds will remember this because it will have enhanced their friendship, but the haters will have forgotten the Weeds and moved on to hating someone else. I feel confident saying this because my then-wife and I came out in a very similar way six years ago, to much the same reaction, and by now pretty much everyone has forgotten us and we've gone on with our lives. Like the movie title says, the kids are all right.
To Mike and all the rest of you: I am the anon who first started this comment. I too know Josh and Lolly, most likely better than you. I have a secret myself. I am the family member who stands in their inner, inner circle, secretly un-supportive, because I do not know HOW TO SUPPORT THIS. Bitter? Yes. You know nothing about what's REALLY happening here. This thread is the only way my voice can be heard! The only way I have to declare my opposition while keeping family ties. Anyone who would consider making it onto GAWKER.com an accomplishment is looking for nothing but their 15 minutes! Have ya checked it out? Do you think a subject as important as this should be read along with Lindsey Lohan's latest drama? Or pictures of zombie cannabalism? Yeah, that's right where you want a deeply spiritual journey that has the potential to effectively change his life forever, published. When I see him on Mormon.org, The Ensign, or on LDS.org, I'll stop believing that he doesn't at least on some level want this 15 minutes more than he wants anything else.
You said you have a secret.
Do you decapitate babies?
I'm just joking (of course). 😉
To be bitter is wrong per se.
To "want at least on some level 15 minutes of fame" is not wrong per se.
Josh doesn't seem to be volunteering to be considered making it into GAWKER.
And by the way, Annonymus, tell us "what's REALLY happening" there.
Anonymous, I think that if you have something to say to Josh and Lolly, you should probably figure out how to say it without rancor and then tell them in person. Tell them how you feel, not what you have decided their motives are. Tell them about your bitterness, not what you think is wrong with them. It works…talking honestly and openly is difficult, but it works. In the mean time, though it may not be well received, here is something that you might meditate on:
"I don't Like your Motives …Well, not the ones I've Decided you Have!"
http://reasonable-thought.blogspot.com/2012/05/i-dont-like-your-motives-well-not-ones.html
From the moment we first read this story……and, my husband and I are not operating as mean-spirited, bitter, intolerant and uneducated people. We are both college graduates, have served in Christian ministry and he has a D.Min., graduating from seminary. We have both either owned businesses or had high-level career positions (and we've seen and heard a lot through the years).
With that said, we both have felt that this story sounded like a marketing ploy and/or publicity stunt. It's the perfect story, and a very marketable gimmick, especially since this entire country is obsessed with the subject of homosexuality…..and sex, in general. Nothing is sacred anymore. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Everyone wants to air their laundry on the clothesline for all to see. Reality TV has turned this culture upside down.
Think about it…..Josh is already receiving national attention on Gawker, the UK's Daily Mail….and has an invitation to appear on a national TV show. Then, what's next? Book Deals? A Movie? An interview with Oprah? This could be a very lucrative opportunity that could pay off monetarily for a very long time. Anyway, I do believe that parents who truly care about their precious children would have kept this matter private. The world doesn't need a window to our bedrooms…..and the children would be better served to not be in the middle of a three-ring circus.
There is one reason and one reason only to come out in such a way. To help those who mightily struggle with the same issue and are perhaps even on a brink of a suicide.
I trust Josh. I believe he is authentic and real. I may be wrong, but that's what I believe. Time will tell who is right.
For the family member who has commented anonymously and feels bitter/unsupportive:
I had the same reaction to the coming out post as you. I jokingly thought, " I didn't know homosexuality was a career?" In the subsequent video post the couple said they had been scared and thought they would get generally negative responses. I truly doubt they didn't have some idea that it would be well received. I get so sick of hearing about how this person is gay or that person is gay. It's the victim card of the century and boy how people love an underdog.
But, the other part of me thought, how much of my reaction has to do with my own life. If I was truly happy with everything going on in my life would I feel this way? If I'm being honest then I would have to say probably not.
So I read the coming out post again. I really think this situation is special and unique. I think many could benefit from it and I think that it is important that someone that is gay is out there saying that we are more than the sum of our desires/temptations/attractions. It's rare to have anyone stand in that position and I think it's desperately needed. If Josh gives that position credence because he is gay, then great. I am just glad someone out there is standing up for the right. It's exceptional.
Best to you.
Dear "I am the family member who stands in their inner, inner circle, secretly un-supportive, because I do not know HOW TO SUPPORT THIS."
Josh is my brother, not sure wherein you lie in the inner-inner circle but I for sure am about as far in as you can get. You should know that although they would be hurt you don't support them they would love you regardless and be understanding. Did you not read the original post? They said they completely understand feelings of anger etc. I'm sure they would rather you be honest with them than pretend to support them when you don't. Not sure why you don't support them or are so upset but they are open for discussion. You have the luxury of being able to pick up the phone and call them unlike many other readers who have questions and concerns, so use it.
I really admire parents like you. It amazing that you aren't shying away and "shunning" talk about hard topics. Sex being at the top of the list. This is generally not the case and it wasn't for me. I had the minivan talk (the one where your mom or dad take you driving and teach you about the birds and bees but don't have to make I contact with you) so thanks for being an example to children and parents. You be the best 🙂
You guys were already some of the most awesome people I know. Now you've blown my mind and the minds of thousands with your awesomeness. Keep up the good work guys.
On Friday I was in Rexburg. Everyone I hung out with was talking about you. On Saturday I was at Jenni's. Of course, all the girls were talking about you. On Sunday, I was with my extended fam in Salt Lake. They were all talking about you. I talked to my sis who lives back east and isn't an active Mormon. She told me about your post and that she cried through the entire second half. My bro-in-law left the LDS church years ago. He was so deeply touched by your post that he said it's making him question his spirituality. And your effect on me has been life-changing. Everyone loves the Weeds, all the Weeds. And now I finally figured out why. It's not just that you're cool people. It's that you and your family have this remarkable gift for loving everyone unconditionally. Your parents loved you and your siblings unconditionally. You & your bros & sisters do the same. It finally explains to me why people always flocked to Jenni in college and why they flock to every member of your family. I appreciate you and Lol so much. The times I've been with you, I've always been so moved by your close friendship, admiration for each other, and constant laughing together. I'll say it once again, I love the Weeds.
I haven't really replied much because everything I type out makes me sound like a total goob. But I agree 100% with Becky. I have been so blessed to have Weeds in my life, and as I have read your blog and wished I knew you two better I have become increasingly disappointed that I didn't weasel my way more into your lives before you became ridiculously gay-famous. 😉
All joking aside, proud of you, and proud to know you (ALMOST!) 😀
Dear Josh and Lolly – I Love the Weeds too. Best people ever. I wish you the best and hope you can do a lot of good for people struggling with this. I don't understand some things. But I know this that I love you and your dear parents and Lolly's family with all my heart. Vickie Huish
I think it's wonderful that you two have found happiness, but what will you do if one of your daughters is gay and can't find happiness with a man? What you have is so uncommon, and your kids are growing up in a world where it's much easier to just. be. gay. If one of your daughters loves a woman, will you expect her to set that aside in favor of the nearly-impossible struggle of finding what you have?
You know I've read you for ages now and I'm so pleased that this is going good for you. You all deserve good things.
Regarding the age to tell the kids thing, my 9-year-old daughter knows that her 17-year-old brother is gay and has known for a while. She seems to be handling it. I believe that she's learning that he is the same brother that he was before we all knew that he is gay and she loves him just the same. What better lesson could she learn from this situation?
To the Anon guy questioning the timing. Having known Josh personally for many years, I can tell you that he honestly has no agenda, ulterior motive or anything otherwise. He is a sincere guy just trying to make his way in the world and do what he feels is right for he and his family. Honestly, he likely hadn't thought that far ahead to use this to help Romney, the LDS church or piggyback off other prominent stories or people. You give him WAAAAAY too much credit. (Amirite Josh? 😉
You guys rock! I have the extreme social awkwardness on the phone, too. I've come to the conclusion that in my case, less is more. I have to actively think about closing my mouth – not just because I say incredibly stupid things, but because I literally keep my mouth open when I'm listening – which is just an invitation for a dry mouth and interrupting and betraying my sweating palms in verbal form. It's awesome. Not as awesome as you guys are, though! Carry on, carry on, carry on.
I have to give a HUGE thank you to Tara at faithinambibuity.blogspot.com. She posted about your post, which introduced me to your blog. I've been reading your older posts, but had to stop myself because I have kids and laundry and stuff.
Your coming out post was beautiful and heartfelt. I have an openly gay brother (who left the church) and even though your life is completely different from his, your words helped me understand him even more. I do love him and will make sure he knows it more often.
Thank you for sharing your testimony through your story. To me that was the most powerful part. That and the obvious love and devotion you and Lolly have for each other. Your children have incredible parents, they'll be fine.
(You don't really eat spider sandwiches, do you? That's the one thing that would make me stop reading your blog.)
Hi hi! I saw your blog on, you guessed it, facebook! And I am so glad I did. I love your courage. You are facing what is probably the biggest trial in your life with such a great attitude. I love how strong your testimony is. You are amazing in my eyes, unless you really do eat spiders… actually, I am deathly afraid of spiders, so if you do eat them, you are actually doing me a kindness…anyway…I ramble. I am so glad I found your blog! You are hilarious and I will be a regular reader!
I Read your blog the day you posted it, it has given me a lot of comfort as an LDS married mother of 2 who has struggled with SSA since I was 12 or so. I have had counseling to try and "change" this about myself and it's something that has never gone away but been kept at bay.(if that makes sense) I struggle with such guilt that it's something I can't seem to rid myself of or overcome. In the scriptures it talks about how not just our actions but our lust and thoughts are sinful, what is your view on that? You're not acting on your gay thoughts and wants but it's still there. Are we condemed in that?
How are your church leaders an members taking this? As a church Is this a scary thing to finally have out there, that there are faithful members of the LDS church who are married/children who feel they are gay? In your temple interview before you were married is it something your stake leaders knew?
I had the same question- I would assume that your thoughts have to be just as pure as any man that would have lustful thoughts and feelings. However, do you ever have them for Lolly? How does she feel? Does it hurt her that you are NOT attracted to her? She seems to truly feel valued and loved by you, but what about that part of the pie where you feel wanted and attractive to your spouse?
As a faithful gay Mormon married in temple, I can tell that same-sex attraction does not go away. It is like a child that is with you for the rest of your life. Now, children are sometimes pain in the rear-end, they are sometimes annoying, often demanding, but they are also great fun to watch and to deal with (as Josh is so poignantly shows). And they eventually grow up and leave.
I'm not sure if my same-sex attraction will ever grow up and leave me, but I assume that it would, as I grow old and my sexual urge diminishes. However, it will always be my child, I embrace it even if, because of it's "obnoxiousness", I wanted to go away.
Let me be clear. I find denying homosexual feelings to myself not just wrong thing to do, but exactly the opposite of a right thing to do. It can bring a person to utter madness.
I remember the first time I had a crush on a male friend, I tried to fight it mightily. It felt terribly wrong. I thought to myself: "It must be that I mixed up something in my brains. This isn't possible."
That train of thinking brought me to the point where I tried to mentally divorce the feeling of a crush from the person I had a crush in. So, I ended up with a deep, profound emotion, but I couldn't determine towards whom it is felt. That mind boggling separation occurred for only brief period, but I can confidently say that was the lowest point of my life.
Early on I have learned that I should not play that game, for these were the only moments of my existence when I was seriously contemplating suicide.
Now back to brighter side of the story. I believe that the term "gay" is very appropriate for people with same-sex attraction, because, one can properly deal with it only if he or she is as gay as Josh Weed, in one and all of the following senses:
Part of Speech: adjective
Definition: happy
Synonyms: alert, animate, animated, blithe, blithesome, bouncy, brash, carefree, cheerful, cheery, chipper, chirpy, confident, convivial, devil-may-care, festive, forward, frivolous, frolicsome, fun-loving, gamesome, glad, gleeful, hilarious, insouciant, jocund, jolly, jovial, joyful, joyous, keen, lighthearted, lively, merry, mirthful, playful, pleasure-seeking, presuming, pushy, rollicking, self-assertive, sparkling, spirited, sportive, sprightly, sunny, vivacious, wild, zippy
Im curious… Josh, what are your feelings on the legalization of same-sex marriage?
For me, you've answered questions that I've had about this issue, but had no one to ask. It has helped me to understand that people are born with SSA. You've also answered that some can be gay and LDS, I thought that was impossible.
As far as the timing, telling the kids, etc. I know from my experience that following the spirit is not logical to other people on many issues such as what age to marry, abstinence before marriage, paying tithing, accepting callings, etc. This is your perspective, what you have chosen and why; like everything else, we can choose what we do with the information and even pray about the truth of it and what we can do now that we have been educated.
hmmm…just because Josh feels like he developed these attractions at an early age does not prove that you are "born" with SSA. Let's not assume that his experience is scientific proof of anything like that. Even the church and former prophets have said that is not something we know.
Like Jewels, I read your last few posts because Tara recommended them. I'm so glad I did. You and Lolly are what parents should be, what people should be: kind, respectful, accepting, forthright, and operating from a place of love.
I can only guess, but I believe your daughters will handle the news just fine. They are, after all, being raised in a home where truth is welcome and love is the basis of everything. It doesn't get any better than that.
This is more of a test comment. I posted a comment before, like third from the top, saw that it had posted, then came back later and my comment was gone. Wondering if this was a glitch or something.
Anyway, just wanted to offer my support with most everyone else. 🙂
Josh, my ex hub is gay (and no longer lds) and we have a son who is now in his early teens. His dad has always talked to our son about his own life, usually at a developmentally appropriate level. And when our son was about 8, he told a couple of his friends at school that his dad was gay. I was cringing, because I knew it would "hit the fan" in some way at some time. Eventually (in sixth grade) one of his friends got mad at my son and blabbed about it to others, and some of the meaner boys gave him a hard time about it.
Fortunately, two things helped. One is that schools are dealing better with bullying-type situations, but most importantly, he is a very resilient young man. I hope that my trying to treat him respectfully over the years and our many, many great conversations have been part of why he is that way.
School policy can't really stop all meanness–there's no way to regulate snide comments from a kid who is determined to be mean. But my son amazes me with how well he has dealt with things. He seems to be totally okay with himself and who he is. He loves his dad, while at the same time being a strong believer in the lds faith.
You need to create a Blog button so I can announce to the world that I have a new WEED habit. :o)
Hi!
Some media advice: It's normal to feel nervous under the lights, and to feel nervous the entire time leading up to the interview.
If it's television: Know that nervous energy is a good thing! You can channel it to appear more animated. Take deep breaths. And remember to STOP TALKING. Take a moment to think before answering a question, then speak a couple of sentences. End.
Let the interviewer do the work. You're the guest! All you have to do is be yourself – and yourself is awesome! woo hoo!
If it's an interview for print or online: Speak slowly. Ask the reporter to read back your quotes.
About questions: If a question doesn't make sense, don't be afraid to say, "I don't think that's the real issue here."
…As a therapist, I can only imagine you understand the hidden biases and assumptions in any statement. So don't be afraid to say, "Well that question presumes this ABC point of view . . . but I come at it from a different direction."
Truth and love and hugs.
-Total stranger
Joshua Weed, a goodwill machine.
Glad you guys are coming home! We are going through Weed-withdrawal!
While I am happy for Josh and his family, I do have to say that he is the rare, rare, rare exception. I am also a gay, LDS man and married to a woman. It is not easy. I am very selective with whom I share this with, not because of my own denial about my attractions, but because of the sensitive nature of the subject that one cannot fully explain to others…nor should they I believe, at least not on such a public forum. I think there is some clear denial on Josh's part of the difficult nature of this situation. There ARE rough days and weeks. I do question my decision at times. There is definitely a part of me that will never be fully fulfilled in my current situation (emotionally or sexually) and it takes a tremendous amount of resolve and coping to do so. While I do believe Josh and his wife are happy, I think it irresponsible to say things like he is "happy every day" and not go into more detail about the struggles associated with the issue for the gay/lesbian, their spouses, and their children. I do not believe Josh Weed represents what it is truly like to deal with same-sex attraction and be in a heterosexual marriage and feel uncomfortable with him as the self-appointed (inadvertently so) spokesperson for this group. LDS individuals are reading this and walking away from this disclosure with a grossly oversimplified and glorified look at a very sensitive subject. Also, as a therapist himself, I had a very negative reaction to his advertising his services on his blog and making this kind of information available to the people he works with. Many will turn to him in a desperate and vulnerable position to create a similar situation for themselves and will fail…not because they too aren't honest, loving people, but because they are forcing themselves to assimilate seemingly incongruous parts of their identity that God himself has not encouraged or revealed to us how to do. Josh Weed is not the Savior of the afflicted gay/lesbian Christian and those who turn to him for professional advice should proceed with caution. Love him as a person, but realize that as a professional, he is way out of bounds.
Why is it irresponsible to say you're "happy every day"?
I have days that are a struggle, when I wonder where I'll get the strength to take one more step. That doesn't mean I don't also feel happy on those difficult days. I have a loving husband and children, and the gospel of Jesus Christ. No matter what else is happening, I still find happiness- every day.
Thank you so much, Anonymous commenter above, for posting your experience. I have a very close friend who attempted to have everything Josh and Lolly have and it is currently exploding in a very ugly and painful way, with 3 little children along for the ride.
Although I'm sincerely happy for the Weeds, I think it's rare that the ride would be so smooth and joyous for most couples attempting a similar arrangement. I'm afraid thousands of gay LDS men and women will decide that with enough faith, they too can have the Weed's happy ending and that many will end up with shattered families (and perhaps wounded children).
how many parents will forward the Weed's story to their gay sons and daughters with the obvious message, "Why can't YOU be this way? Why is YOUR faith so weak? Why are you such a failure?"
Indeed, how many parents will do exactly that? More than we can count, I'm afraid. As the mother of a gay child, I've heard so many heartbreaking stories from gay adults, especially former-LDS and Catholics. This will only add fuel to the fire.
Anon, I believe you that there are many rough days. How could there not be when so much time and effort must be spent "redirecting" ones thoughts and feelings?
I feel a real sorrow for Josh and his wife. They are missing out on something that those of us who do not have to seperate out our sexuality and our intimacy do not. They may believe their sex life is better than most other peoples, and maybe it is, but there is a bond they are missing. It's easy to dismiss that particular bond as lust or whatnot but it's real, it's important and two decades into my marriage that spark is still a key part of our intimacy.
This is such a good post about the not so happy side of things ..The sad truth is that there are many and I mean many young/older Mormon gay married men who are not happy and can't find a way out after they have children. I do think that Anonymous has hit the nail on the head by saying "Christian and those who turn to him for professional advice should proceed with caution. Love him as a person, but realize that as a professional, he is way out of bounds." Let's all remember that Josh may be telling a story of love and joy, but on the other side of the coin is a story of sadness and little hope for those who continue to stay in there marrige do to Mormon teaching. I would hope that any media that interviews Josh and his family also shows the sad side of the story. I know that out there is an under world of gay LDS married men who are living double lives and that seek out others in very risky ways, we can't live in denial that this happening. But there is also those men that just try to make it work by living a married life that is unfulfilling by not acting on there true feeling .
Anonymous to you I extend hope and love. My heart goes out to you. I hope you know that there are those of us who hear your voice loud and clear and we support you also on your journy .
As gay christian men in a committed relationship , my partner and I will be praying for you. Don't lose hope or light. You can look our story up in the Salt Lake Tribune, Steven Fehr LDS and gay: Believer reconciles faith, love ,,,,,May God Bless you and may all of you who seek healing find the right path for you heart …
As a faithful gay Mormon married in temple, I would respectfully disagree with a notion that The Weeds are an exception.
I have a gut feeling that there is tens if not hundreds of thousands of people like Josh and myself of every conceivable faith, including Mormon, who are living a fulfilling, productive lives without making much fuss about it.
That my feeling of course cannot be proven for obvious reasons, and that's where I find Josh's decision to come out to the world so stunningly important.
He is the harbinger and the captain of many who will follow his path to show that we are not a tiny, boisterous minority, but a silent legion.
On the other hand, by following Josh's example, we would never EVER deny or undermine excruciating pain and suffering that many of our ilk have been going through, and we will never EVER condemn any of them for making any number of decisions that can be made in circumstances they are in. We will love them, accept them and respect them unconditionally.
I firmly believe that the topic of homosexuality is so complex and so important in each gay person's life that no agency less than God could or should judge any one's decision related to it.
I completely agree that if you are not attracted to or turned on by your partner, something is missing! I think intimacy includes that sexual attraction, it's not one or the other.
I was debating whether or not to put a comment on your other post, but I thought I'd put it here because I didn't want it to get lost. Thanks so much for your post!!!! I'm LDS, and I'm straight, but I have really good friends who are gay and feel really conflicted about their sexuality and the teachings of the church. I know that your lifestyle may not be the solution for everybody, but I am so glad to see that you have found a way to be happily married, have a family, and remain true to the teachings of the church. It's inspiring to see you be so open about your sexuality, and I can't imagine how terrifying it may have been for you to put this out for almost literally the whole world to see! I wish you and your family all the happiness in the world, and happy anniversary! God bless 😀
This is so amazing! I keep going back and reading and sharing with people!! Thank you for being honest, this will help so many people and relationships straight or gay. Truly inspirational! Thank you!
-Tessa O
Josh your writing is hilarious and fluid – I really enjoy reading! My mom told me that my dad was gay when I was 10 . . . my brother was 13. He lived quite a few states away so we didn't see him very often – but he was coming in town for a family reunion and my mom wanted to tell us beforehand just in case any of the extended family let something slip. I shrugged my shoulders and my brother asked, "How could this happen to our dad?" It is a difficult conversation . . . and I feel for you. I know your kids, having grown up with accepting and open parents, won't have the same trouble I did . . . but I tried to "save" my dad for the next 11 years . . . and then finally accepted him for who he was, tried to understand him based on what HE said, and have grown closer to him than ever. He is gay, he lives a gay lifestyle, but that is just fine 🙂 Here's my blog where I talk a little more about it: http://accidentalatheist.wordpress.com/about/
Make sure to check out this article: http://accidentalatheist.wordpress.com/2012/04/01/a-mormon-boys-mission-to-save-his-father/
That was a quesiton in my head and I'm so glad there are parents like you who can teach their children about things like this. There are just too many parents these days who figure their child will just learn about "stuff" at school or through peer groups. That's so dumb!
"But here's the thing about me: […] I completely suck at talking on the phone. I'm always running over people's sentences and saying weird crap and talking at all the wrong moments and laughing at inappropriate things. The conversation with this guy went pretty well overall, but then as the call was winding down, I failed to realize that the call was coming to a close, and so in the precise moment that he said the word "goodbye" I spastically blurted something like "Because the thing I really want to communicate is that love is the clarion call of our post and what we hope to help share with the world…"
Josh, this is SO DARN GAY!!!! 🙂
And I mean
Part of Speech: adjective
Definition: happy
Synonyms: alert, animate, animated, blithe, blithesome, bouncy, brash, carefree, cheerful, cheery, chipper, chirpy, confident, convivial, devil-may-care, festive, forward, frivolous, frolicsome, fun-loving, gamesome, glad, gleeful, hilarious, insouciant, jocund, jolly, jovial, joyful, joyous, keen, lighthearted, lively, merry, mirthful, playful, pleasure-seeking, presuming, pushy, rollicking, self-assertive, sparkling, spirited, sportive, sprightly, sunny, vivacious, wild, zippy
I read your post on Friday and I've been mulling it over and over and over. First, I'm LDS, as far as I can calculate I think we're about the same age, and so you know that our generation didn't really grow up with a lot of "out" friends, right? And with all the focus on homosexuality in the media over the past several years, it's a topic that has been at odds with my religious and personal beliefs for years now. Your post was beautifully written, so thoughtful, sensitive, and real and I am so glad I came across it via Facebook.
So I have a question and it may come from my naivete or you may have already been asked and answered but I didn't read all 30 million comments so I'm going to ask anyway:
How can you still consider yourself gay?
I'm confused, quite simply. Here's why: I've been married for just over 8 years now. The hormones and physical reactions to attractive guys that I used to have as a teenage & college student have completely simmered down, if that makes sense. My husband is simply enough, right? Sure, I can still say this guy or that guy or this girl or that girl are attractive, I might have some kind of slight physical/hormonal reaction to them, but I am certainly not aroused (for lack of a better term) by anyone other than my husband. From what you write about your relationship with your wife, whatever happens in your bedroom together is more than fulfilling enough for you. I don't care about what goes on in your bedroom AT ALL, I'm not saying that! I guess I'm asking how you draw the line and realize that yes, you are in fact still gay even though you haven't lived a homosexual lifestyle.
Maybe it's a dumb question, like asking how I know I'm straight. I get that. But because homosexuality is not a part of my life in any way (I don't think I can name even one close friend who is gay), I really just don't understand.
I'm sure Josh could answer your question more eloquently than I could ever hope, and I anticipate that some day he will find time to do it, but until then, let me share my experience.
The devil is in the detail, and the devil here is precisely this "physical reaction to attractive guys" that, in your case, "simmered down", although not completely, as it appears ever so often as "slight reaction".
Well, that "physical reaction" does "simmer down" in me (and in Josh, I assume) as a fulfilling relationship with a member of the opposite sex is developed and consumed.
However, in a gay person with a healthy heterosexual relationship it comes back as a continuous reminder that there is something different, unusual about us, which then creates perpetual propensity for seeking understanding.
Such urge to seek understanding does not exist in the mind and heart of a heterosexual person in heterosexual relationship (and for that matter, a homosexual person in a homosexual relationship) when they want to remain faithful to the spouse. And that for obvious reasons – because, there is indeed nothing "unusual" about it in their mind.
"Physical reaction" is simply switched, translated from any one person to the spouse, and that's pretty much the end of it. Well, that trick does not necessarily work in mixed orientation relationships.
The key aspect of that impetus to understand is then geared toward reaffirming reality of the inclination (instead, for example, denying it), and then dealing with it in most ingenious ways.
Josh, it seems, found a superb way of handling it. He talks about it, pokes fun at it, continuously questions it and reaffirms it, and expresses it in most appropriate ways, without shame or guilt.
Denying it, however, in such an arrangement is not, and probably should not be an option.
Just to follow up with this, also not being gay:) So, is this any different that someone who is never married and also does not have sexual relationships? I mean, it just seems to me that this would be a similar situation.
Yes, it is similar, but it is also slightly different, not much, it is just enough different so that is different a world apart. 🙂
In order to properly answer, one might need to know if an unmarried person is gay or straight, whether he or she wants to develop a romantic relationship or not (celibacy), and if yes, whether with a person of the same or the opposite sex. Finally, one might need to know if the person really wants to be committed, or just pretends.
Here I would assume that you ask about an unmarried heterosexual who is seeking a mate, but hasn't got there yet.
Differences in such a scenario between that person and myself (I'm like Josh) are slightly greater than, say, in a case of an unmarried homosexual or married heterosexual.
The first difference is obvious: I am "different", "unusual" in my mind (for Heaven's sake, NOT "bad"!), he or she is not. So they simply take their feelings for granted, and try to steer it in whatever direction their moral compass is leading them to: either towards a dispensable affair or towards a marriage.
As for me, trust me, I do not take my feelings for granted. Where an unmarried heterosexual is already on the journey, I'm doing a deep and comprehensive soul search to figure out where I stand and where I go.
The second difference is not so obvious, and it has something to do with my decision to marry a member of the opposite sex. An unmarried person does not think about "what will happen next". He or she pretty much knows it, desires it, anticipates it.
On the other hand, I desire it, anticipate it, but in a completely different way. If I were Josh, I would talk about it, poke fun at it, continuously question it and reaffirm it, and try to express it in most appropriate ways.
An unmarried heterosexual simply does not have a tendency to do it, because he is totally oblivious to the fact that there is something very special and sacred happening at the very moment of sexuality kicking in. He may realize that later on, but at that moment, he or she takes it as is, without a question.
Josh and Lolly,
I just wanted to say, as a gay man and devout Catholic, I can't thank you enough for your courage in writing your previous piece. While I am comfortable with my sexual orientation, and fully accept that my future kids will be adopted–I'm adopted and don't feel like I'm giving anything up by adopting–your honesty and the comfort you offered to those struggling with their identities was touching.
I'm sure your choices will incur ostracism from both sides of this contentious issue, but I would encourage you to continue to lend your voice to this important discussion on sexuality and family.
Many blessings!
This week my kids learned about homosexuality. It happened because we were watching a show on the food network and a woman on the show kept talking about her wife. The first time she said it, I glanced at my kids to see what they thought, there was no reaction so I felt relief. The next time the Lesbian woman said "My Wife…" my most inquisitive daughter who is eight said "What is she talking a bout, she is a girl, she should have a husband right?" All my kids were there, ages 4,6,8, and 9 and so we had the discussion. It went fine, it was super basic, (they dont know really what sex is yet, just that mommy and daddy do it, it involves kissing and making babies but that is it.) Anyways there were some Yucks and Ewes about boys kissing boys and girls kissing girls, but all in all it went fine. I guess it had to happen sometime. Good luck with Telling your children. I hope it goes as well as my conversation went with my kids.
I have yet to comment on anything, but I swear I've read about 90% of the comments for the last three posts. I can't stop myself! And…as always, I love you guys and think you are so great. So many of my friends have talked to me about you guys, and they have all been great conversations. I really think you guys are opening up some great dialogue….and for that I am so so proud of you two. And…everyone is right, Lolly…you are hott. And also, it's insane how much Anna looks like Lolly. I mean…holy cow, she's identical! And hilarious! Miss you guys!!
-Kayla
Hello Josh
I have read your post and I must say I believe it can come across as a dangerous Point of View for young gay Mormon youth that are struggling with there homosexually. Because of how fast your post has travel around the world we can already see people using this story as example that marriage can be the answer to what some people call " gay Issues"
The truth is you are the exception to the rule.
I would hope that if you go on to be interviewed by networks talk shows that you choose to be very transparent's about the many questions that people are going to ask.
I have added a link to a story below that you and other might want to read…
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/lifestyle/50729998-80/fehr-isaiah-lds-says.html.csp
You know, I get this concern, but quite honestly, as an lds straight person, I get that it is way more complicated than this. And while I think it gives some people hope, I think they also get that this may not be the answer. In fact most of what I see written in the comments…well, they don't say this about being "the" answer, just that it is good to talk about in a respectful loving way.
For me it was how kind they were about sharing their story. I hav never seen a post about this issue (from either side) that showed so much love and compassion for those who may dissagree with them. Also… and I don't mean for this to be hostel in anyway but this argument about how Josh sharing is story is not okay seems backward to me… if the gay community wants respect for their lifestyle then they should be excepting of all the different forms that lifestyle takes. Josh and Lolly have as much right to share there story and who they are as anyone else ( especially when they do it with such generous and excepting hearts)
Ipelon I for one don't have a problem with him sharing his story but I do have a problem when the church as we know it does advocate this sort of thing to solve the "Gay Issue or Problem". I also find it dangerous when someone like Josh that is also a therapist says he is "happy every day". Even I a person who has strong faith find days where I wonder if my faith strong enough to get me through the day. Let's be real here, no of us are perfect or have every day of our lives filled with happiness. As we know Mormon teaching talk about the Perfect Family , Josh would love for us to believe that everything is great but the real truth is , is it really ? . Josh is truly following Mormon teaching by showing us that even tho he is gay everything is fine because he was honest to his wife from the beginning but I am having a hard time believing it ,but that's ok, we all have our opinions and I am praying that God give me more understanding .
I would like to share a link with you of the other side of this. It is well written and i think you might see not only one side but the sad truth of the other side. http://cedarpocket.wordpress.com/2012/06/13/in-which-i-feel-compelled-to-start-a-blog-because-of-a-club-and-a-unicorn/
Also if you haven't yet I would invite you to read the story of my partner as found in this link…
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/lifestyle/50729998-80/fehr-isaiah-lds-says.html.csp
May God bless you and may all of us find more understanding as we all continue to read and comment on this blog
I became aware of your first (amazing) post through one of your friend's Facebook feeds. I read your post when there were only 22 comments, and wanted to chime in with how authentic, articulate and powerful I thought it was. But I chickened out. Luckily it looks like thousands of others have been braver than I was and have told you what an amazing couple you are.
The thing that strikes me about your writing is how like a testimony it sounds: No one can really successfully tell you that something you know or have experienced isn't true. I think that's what makes it so powerful, to see you and your family's happiness, because it's so genuine. And whatever someone might think about homosexuality, or families, or Mormonism, nobody can legitimately argue against what you know to be a good and wonderful. So please keep being good and wonderful, because you really are.
I too read your post through a friends Facebook post (Have you hit Ireland yet? you have now!) I just wanted to say thanks for being so brave. We are moving back to America and I know how the issue is so heated right now. I've actually been nervous about moving back because it is such an uncomfortable discussion. I never know what to say about what we believe, and what is possible, and put it all out there in a way that is loving. But you did. Good job and thank you. Good luck to you and your family.
This isn't going to be an eloquent comment with any insight whatsoever, just wanted to say a simple thank you for continuing to make a complicated topic more approachable. Sometimes I think it's easy as members of the LDS faith to bury our heads in the sand about certain topics. I think SSA is one of those topics. Things are so much easier to deal with and think about when light is shed upon them. When difficult topics are shoved in a dark corner of a long forgotten box those topics only get scarier and more untouchable. SSA is not going away, no matter how much some people may want it to. It's better to get it out in the open and deal with it. So thank you.
In the original 'Out' post Lolly wrote that: "My parents did an amazing job in teaching their children about the proper role of sexuality. In our home, sex was viewed as sacred, enjoyable, and something to look forward to in marriage. I saw the important role that intimacy played in successful marriages and that was one aspect of marriage that I was greatly anticipating." I desperately want to know how her parents did that. I would love to read a stand alone post on how Lolly's parents taught the proper role of sexuality. I certainly don't want to bury my head in the sand about this topic either, but I need help!
Please Lolly, please, please, please!
What Melanie said!!
I did read a blog once (dang if I can remember even who wrote it or how I stumbled upon it) about a conversation between a little girl and her mom. The little girl had a friend whose aunt was expecting. For some reason the girl was unusually uncomfortable with the (unknown) information she got from her friend. Her mother observed this and realized that a conversation was VITAL.
They talked. Mom called it "making love," that she and Daddy practice.. and sometimes that love ends up being a baby (the little girl had a baby brother at the time).
The idea of that act being done between two people who are NOT married or who do NOT love each other wasn't even entertained, wasn't even part of the conversation.
The girl was too young at the time for the mechanics and logistics of sex, but even so, her mother began teaching her the correct principals that would enable this girl to wisely govern her own life down the road.
"Teach them correct principals and they govern themselves."
Thank you Mr. and Mrs. Weed for sharing your story of love, courage and family! I am ever so very impressed you and your family. Your story gave me understanding for a side of life I am otherwise not exposed to nor familiar with. I am sure that this post will be buried in the massive amount of responses that you have received. But I wanted to say thank you. My own issues with Depression, Obsessive Compulsive and Anxiety disorders leave me feeling alone and not have a soul on earth to talk to. You gave me a ray of hope that despite my natural tendencies to be frightened and overwhelmed with the simplest of things, I may be able to overcome this and recognize the joy in my life, of which, my mind tells me there is so very much, but I shortfall in recognizing all those amazing things. Your story and blogs, as I have been catching up on, have allowed me to smile, laugh, cry, be confused (I am not the sharpest tool in the shed, so I don’t understand everything), but mostly hope for a day when I will be able share my stories another, without the fear of judgment and disappointment. I know that I am fortunate. I live in a marvelous country, married to a wonderful man who has served and continues to serves faithfully in church and have beautiful children, therefore I have so much to find joy in… you both have allowed me to say, “One day, I will not hide in secret afraid of what others think of me and of being judged”. Mostly, you reminded me that my Savior loves me and wants me to find peace. I see the magnificent blessings in your life as you have followed Heavenly Father’s Plan of Happiness… I guess I needed a reminder that as I follow Gospel Principles and be patient, I will recognize the blessings already present in my life. Thank you both… and I ditto the sentiment from a previous response that “You Guys Rock”!
Much love to you and your family. It's a very courageous and noble thing you've done. The message of tolerance is one the world seems to be learning right now, in many areas. Thank you for being a positive example for us all.
BTW, I've just recently come across your blog, and I've never laughed so hard! Good stuff.
I forgot to say- I have the same problem with talking on the phone! And my voice doesn't help, I sound really young. Once I answered the phone (which was for my husband) and the lady said in a sing song-baby-talk voice, "Is your Daddy there?" What do you say to that!?
"No- he's retired.. but my husband is.. and yes, I'm legal." (with a smirk in the voice)
I love sarcasm 😉
I will now be reading your blog and praying for you guys. What a beautiful family you are, and what a brilliant example of God's love!
I think you're on the right track about talking to the kids. If you are willing to talk to them about hard stuff, they will learn to be honest with you (which will be important when they're 15). When my daughters were small my rule of thumb was: if they ask a question, they're ready for the answer. My older daughter started asking intelligent questions about sex when she was five. Best wishes.
Same thing happened to us…my kids started asked about sex early on:) Of course, they don't need all the details right away, but we definitively start down that road:)
Whatever the actual truth may be, there's a belief among many that Mormonism is sexually repressive and homophobic. Your coming out as gay is not going to change anyone's mind about that – indeed, it will probably reinforce the belief. Sorry, this whole performance is a little too airbrushed and cheery to seem real, and I wonder if it would have run if the Republican candidate for President weren't Mormon. This is the Church's way of saying – we love gay people, we really do – as long as they only have heterosexual relationships. This way the Church can claim it isn't homophobic.
Reading some of the other comments has brought something else to mind. Over the political debate about gay rights and gay marriage hovers one cloud of a question: is it a choice? Most people defending gay rights will point to evidence that it is not a choice.
As a gay man who has been married to a woman (who I loved, but who was not happy to stay with a gay man) and who has moved on to find happiness in a same-sex relationship, I'm not sure how much of it is biology and how much conditioning, how much it is a choice or not. My argument is: it shouldn't matter. What matters is my freedom to love who I choose, regardless of how anyone might judge my feelings. My love deserves honour and support from my community, just as I respect other people's relationships. We talk about falling in love like it's something that just happens to us, and in fact that is part of the initial bond. But sharing your life with someone is a choice. Such choice must be based on freedom rather than coercion, or it isn't love. Josh and Lolly, you choose to love one another against difficult odds just as many same-sex couples have made choices when factors were stacked against them. We should be taking down barriers to people loving one another rather than making rules. So don't worry when anyone casts doubt on your choice. I wish you great happiness and a long life together.
Amen, Van Waffle. Well spoken.
"Rainbows, unicorns…DECAPITATED BABY." Love it!! Can you please quit your job and just do a new post every day. I have absolutely loved reading your blog the last two days. Thanks Josh! You make my day!
Don't forget the spider sandwiches…actually I heard they go with Ghost Pepper Sauce.
Anyway I agree, laughed out loud with that comment.
John
Josh is a gifted writer. His coming-out post brought me here, but all the posts that preceded it (and hopefully the ones that will follow it) made me stay. He's fun to read. So is his beautiful wife, of course, but Josh has a real gift for the written word.
For what it's worth: I was led here from FB along with thousands of other readers. I was surprised and amazed at what I read. I say "congratulations." I know that J&L's solution won't work for everybody, but I congratulate them on making it work, and pointing the way for those who want to (and choose to) follow.
Wow. You two are brave. There are 2 great perils here: hatred that the Internet can deliver, and the celebrity. Don't ever Jon and Kate on us. Have problems or solutions like everyone, but don't let this be a lever in your relationship, now or ever.
I hope you keep sharing far and wide. Your story is a love story and I thank you for having the courage and honesty to share it. I'm absolutely blessed to have read it. It's helped me love my brother and recommit to trying harder. There are many valuable voices with varying perspectives, and yours is so clear, so sweet, and so neutral. God bless you for sharing and good luck dealing with the unintended consequences.
Huge fan. Huge. I mean, I don't want to see this commercialized – but where can I buy the T shirt? Truly, I want to root forever more for team Weed. I may not even ever read the blog again for fear that you'll change. God bless.
If you are ok with strong responses then WHY you deleting people's comments? Genuinely confused as to why you are doing that.
The author of the comment is deleting it, not Josh. I think you have to publish your comment logged in with a google account to be able to delete it. (I tried it below to make sure)
Love this post. P.S. Your girls are the cutest.
Also, I laughed out loud several times as I read this post, which was needed. Awesome.
i expected nothing less than an awesome response to that question! use the spirit? best idea ever. LOVE? even better. but a combo? ultimate. and i must say that knowing how open you are and the fact that you are a therapist… totally relieves my soul from any stress concerning this whole thing.
next question that i am dying to know… but afraid to ask…
what will it be like to go to your ward on Sunday? i would be terrified to go to church after all this… but i am sure you are way more brave than i am in that department, but i mean… i just hope that things go well. and i mean that sincerely.
this blog has changed my life. i cannot emphasize that enough. the end.
Thank you Josh for your post. I first heard of your blog on the news in Utah. It is great and I've enjoyed reading it. I too am LDS, married (9 yrs), have 5 childern, and I'm gay. Until last night I thought I was alone. It's hard to describe the feelings one experiences when you find yourself in a situation like mine that no one (that you're aware of) can related to. To have no one that understands how you feel is…hopeless. That's about the closest word I can come up with. I, unlike you, hid my SSA from everyone as long as I could. When my wife and I were married she had no idea that I was attracted to men. I regret that. It wasn't fair to her. I thought that being married would make my attractions for men go away. After a few years of marriage I realized that I was mistaken. My attractions had become so strong that I was considering acting on them. At this time I told my wife. I was expecting her to leave me. Instead she, being the amazing person that she is, was 100% supportive and loving. I owe so much to her. It's not easy for me. It's not easy for her. You make it sound like it's a picnic compared to the feelings I deal with every day. Maybe for you it is a picnic. If that's the case then congratulations because I'm sue that it didn't come without much hard work and practice. Your "coming out" came at a great time for me as I have been once again struggling with my decision to live a "heterosexual lifestyle". I couldn't imagine that any other man could feel the same things I feel and make a marriage to a woman work. All I had heard was stories about men that had been married and then came out and ended their marriage. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with people in that situation I'm just saying those are the only situations that I was hearing of. So, my situation seemed impossible. No hope. My marriage was destined to go down in a great ball of flames(no pun intendend). Then when I had all but given up I saw your story. You have given me new hope that I can do this. Not because I'm trying to be something I'm not, but because I love my wife and my kids and my God and they make me who I am. Thank You!
Kudos to you and your wife *hugs
I can only guess at the struggles you two face on a daily basis, but I'm grateful for your commitment to each other and to obedience to Father. He does .. and will continue to bless you for it.
Again, *hugs all around
Wow! Thank you for your post. We are all born with tendencies toward something. For some it is alcoholism, pornography, lying, cheating….for you it happens to be SSA. As a member of the LDS church I understand your desire to love God and to live within the bounds that He has set. I do not struggle with SSA, but I do have struggles. Knowing that everyone has struggles with something is comforting. Does that sound weird?? I appreciate reading your post because it sounds like you are a strong individual who wants to live the gospel. I'm glad that your wife is understanding. Her strength, I'm sure will buoy you up….as well as this blog.
Hey Josh and Lolly, I know you guys have had like a million comments/questions etc and you'll probably never get around to answering this one (which I will totally understand since you guys are rockstars and are answering a whole bunch of probably more interesting questions) but can I ask if you advocate for LGBTQ LDS to come out even if they are going to choose the lifestyle you lead?
I'm a 22 year old (female) YSA who has identified for a long time as bisexual, I've never told a soul because I figured that I can make the choice to just get a temple marriage and be satisfied with that. But with you and others like you telling your stories, I'm starting to think that maybe it's important to come out to just show the membership of the church that we do exist, regardless of what they think. What are your thoughts on that matter? (Other commenters, feel free to give me (legit) advice too.)
Katy- I would come out to those that I am close to and that I love. I identify as bisexual now, because it is truly how I feel…attracted to both sexes. In this space I feel we have it worse because people are always so quick and apt to say "see, you can choose… and why would you choose that?" For myself, I am attracted to PEOPLE, not GENDER/SEX. I have fallen in love with both men and women. I cannot say that I love either one more, the relationships are not even the same. I agree with you, the church seems to be so "hush hush" about sexuality. I learned about Affirmation maybe 3 years ago. I was astonished. I think it's because it's so frowned upon (as any other sin) that it is not talked about AS OPENLY. Who knows how many other brothers and sisters are out there just like us? Josh has definitely opened the lines of communication here, and that's why I'm so happy about it. It is NOT typical, but it IS happening… successful or not. It's a cold cold world in the LDS community for those of us who find themselves in this space and having been devout members of the church. Back to your question, about a handful of members of my ward know of my sexual orientation. They only know because they were there for me during my divorce. These conversations are very taboo and only had oftentimes behind a closed bishops door. If you do come out, be prepared for the typical sneers and jeers. I am praying that I either find more saints like myself so that I may laugh and cry freely with them, safely. I know, like you know that they're (we're) out there… I say do what's best for you, and pray about it 🙂 <3
I love Josh's story, and his bravery in blogging about it, but I don't think it's a recommendation to do the same. Like I've read from several other people, sexual orientation doesn't need to be your identity. In telling your close, supportive friends, and even your bishop, you will find support and love and still retain your identity. But in "coming out" to everyone in your ward or area, you'll be more widely known by your sexual orientation that you would be by who you are period.
I know that will make some people mad, but it's just the truth. And it's not really the fault of the people you would tell. If you reveal personal information to people that you really have no relationship with, that's going to be the absolute most they know about you. If you tell your best friend Betsy about it, she's going to say "Hey! You're still the same person I play softball with, or cook spaghetti with, or watch chick flicks/action movies with, or tip cows with, or ____…." But if you tell Old Man Bob down the road that you have literally said 2 words to, he's going to say "Hey! There's the bisexual!"
For me (who has no experience with these feelings but does have personal things I keep to myself for these reasons), I would say start out small if you feel you want or need the support, and go from there.
Katy– For me, the realization that I am something other than 100% straight (whether that be bi or lesbian, I can't say for certain and will probably never know), has come on quite gradually over the last several years. I have been married to a man in the temple for seven years, we have three beautiful boys, and I am happy with my life. Would I trade that simply for the chance to find my "ideal sexual partner"? Not on your life! That door is closed forever, and I am fine with that. In the "eternal scheme," it doesn't matter.
Do I feel the need to "come out" to friends and family? Not really. I have shared a bit with my husband as we discussed Josh's article the other night: to say that I understand what it's like to be attracted to another woman; that if it hadn't been for my faith and commitment to be married to a eternal companion in the temple, I could have easily been persuaded to "swing" the other way; that I've had very vivid dreams about making love with other women and was always relieved to wake up and realize it was just a dream (though I've also dreamed plenty of times of making love with my husband, too!).
If the subject ever came up somehow, and the Spirit moved me to say something, I might talk about it with another friend or family member; but for the most part, it's just really no one else's business– just like my post-partum depression after my second baby was no one else's business unless they were in a position to somehow offer help and support.
I do think it would be a good thing to confide to your possible future husband, as it is important to nurture a bond of trust and openness.
My story is too long to share, but let me assure you, I have had experiences that have shown me that the Lord wants us to understand homosexuality and really love all our brothers and sisters. I agree with Anon above that we should not be defined by our sexual orientation. It does not mean that if you are compelled to share your story that you shouldn't. Take Josh's example for instance. It seems to me like him and Lolly really thought about this one long and hard. On the other hand is (Gay) Mormon Guy (look him up if you aren't familiar with him) who has written about how his Anon status is currently important to him.
I believe we are at a time when, because of how society is changing, that the Lord really is opening our minds to understanding. Directly or indirectly. In my case it was very direct, though I myself I'm straight. But like with everything else, He gives us only as much as we can understand, little by little. It's a gradual process. So, have everyone come out immediately? Maybe not. Have each of you pray about it and discuss it personally with the Lord? Most definitely. Each experience is different and they each might help different people right when they need it. (And some of you, unfortunately, may still be in wards where, bless their dang little hearts, bishops aren't ready).
To Anonymous,
I don't mean to minimize your situation, I am genuinely curious. You said the bi feelings have been developing over the past years and you have dreams of making love to other women. I am wondering. Do you watch TV? Over the past years you really can't watch a television show without witnessing women or men kissing. I know that often my dreams are effected by what I watch and do. I'm not saying you are watching "bad" shows, but they all have it nowadays.
This is going to be really unpopular, but I wonder if how much we see of this on TV is influencing how many people are identifying themselves with this. I'm not saying they were not pre-disposed, but maybe if they had been born in another time and never heard of homosexuality, they would have never thought of it on their own.
I'm really not trying to judge. I've been trying to understand this for a long time and I appreciate all the open conversation about this so I can learn more.
Sorry, for posting as "Anonymous." I don't mean to hide, but I don't have a Google account.
Sorry, I meant to say that the REALIZATION has been gradual, not the feelings themselves (though I did not recognize the feelings for what they were when I was younger, not yet fully understanding the sexual experience). It is only looking back as a now-sexually-active adult that I can recognize certain incidents from when I was a youth being attracted to other young women.
As for the idea that my dreams have been affected by television/movies…I can understand why you might think that, but no. The "onset" of these dreams is just too coincidental; it actually coincides with my very first sexual experience– yes, I started having these dreams on my wedding night (talk about unnerving!).
to the anon asking about movies and things- i know you were not speaking to me, but idk how you may have forgotten, not thought about or how you've been mistaken- but homosexuality is not something that just sprang up… it's been around for a very very long time. the difference is that it is "out in the open" more than ever before; but homosexuality is nothing "new under the sun." i am grateful at the fact that you are trying to understand certain things about it though instead of being ignorant. i love you for this. thank you for facing a fear and finding out about it instead of being rude and judgemental. God bless you
Josh and Lolly, I found your blog through a friend on fb after your post about coming out. I 1st have to say you're hysterical. I am laughing so hard reading this. 2nd I'm super proud of you, and I know what it's like to have your life change overnight. (I was a guest on Oprah Winfrey and suddenly people knew me) so good luck with the News show! I think you'll do awesome! and 3rd, thank you for being so open on honest about not only homosexualtiy, but Mental Illness. I wish I lived in WA so I could see you as my therapist. I have ADHD and Bipolar Disorder, and I love when people actually talk about things like this. I am loving your blog and can't wait to read more. Good luck with all your upcoming cool experiences that are just starting! You guys are amazing, and feel honored to have found your blog and be reading it. 🙂
-Jilly Strasburg-
As a faithful gay Mormon married in temple, who is at the same wavelength with Josh, I support Prop 8 for one reason and ONE REASON ONLY.
But before I say why I support it, I would first say why I do not support it.
I do not support it because I strongly believe that the state and the government SHOULD NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO with marriage, gay or straight. Marriage is ordained of God, and should be performed by any church of one's choice, and then the government is simply there to protect WITH THE FORCE OF LAW what a particular church, and consequently two individuals, chose to do.
The reason why I support Prop 8 is because there is a sad tendency of the government and the state to increasingly interfere in private affairs of individuals and churches. If such tendency didn't exist, there would be no reason for me to support Prop 8.
Any church should have a right to discriminate against any kind of definition of anything, including against the definition of marriage as a solemn bound between two persons of the same sex. And if there is a slightest chance that such ability to discriminate could be put in jeopardy, I believe that a church has every right to defend itself from such efforts.
Now, let me say this. I really wonder what would be my path if Mormon church had a policy of accepting gay marriages as valid and ordained of God.
I could have taken any number of paths in that case, but I would likely never convert to Mormonism, as I joined the church not until AFTER I decided that with my same-sex attraction I need to do something other than finding a member of the same sex to get involved.
This may sound odd to many, but yes. I am even more awkward than Josh. 🙂
FG….please read the laws that have been passes so far…including Prop 8. There IS protection for churches. Anything you saw that said otherwise was pure propaganda designed to scare you. I believe "the church" and other churches are fearful (perhaps rightly so considering they were forced and or pressured (not gonna get into that debate) into changing doctrine around Polygamy and the Blacks and priesthood. But that's the beauty of separation of church and state as created in our government…if SSM is legal…it will be the government sanctioning the marriage. Churches can choose cause worst case scenario people will always be able to be married at the courthouse. It is the opposite scenario in my view…it is the churches attempting to legislate away this civil right from individuals that is the problem. Governments begin granting the right (as it is a civil right based on multiple US Supreme Court findings) and it was the religious people and/or their churches/beliefs that spurned theme into action. It is the religious people that don't want to grant this right to others. Please read the finding by Judge Walker and read the transcript of the Prop 8 trial. It is very informative. The LDS church's Article of Faith states that they believe in "Worshiping God by the dictates of our own conscience and allow all men the same privilege. Let them worship how, where or what they may." I find their political involvement in Prop 8, albeit sideways, to be in violation of their stated beliefs. I'm a former Mormon who's final straw was this issue. I believe the church and ANY church has the right to make their own decisions about who they will marry. When I educated myself on the different ballots and laws passed, they universally are protecting the churches rights…but the believers and leaders are still in fear. Remember the fear over integration in the 60's???? Same thing. It's gonna all be fine.
Thank you, Alder, for your response. Besides being a faithful gay married Mormon, I have another confession to make.
I am an ardent libertarian and a Ron Paul supporter. And I became one not until LONG AFTER I discovered my same-sex attraction, reconcile with it, then converted to Mormonism, found a girl and marry her in the temple.
I would consider it inextricable part of my growing process.
Since then, I developed a passionate hate for the state, not in terms of violence (as I strongly believe in story of Anti-Nephi-Lehites), but in terms of a principle.
I believe that the government is menace to society, and "a gang of thieves writ large".
I believe the government is taken over and is heading to a disaster.
My argument is that the discussion over Prop 8 between supporters and opposers can pretty much go nowhere, as premises of each side never mingle.
Frankly, I would love to see how things would unfold with the Mormon church if same-sex marriage is recognized nationwide. It may very well end up as polygamy and blacks & priesthood had ended up. But I do not care. I believe that as long as the law and the church doctrine is as is, we should work it out within, just as Josh is doing and I am trying to emulate his example.
And I'm not saying that one shouldn't take a different path. I'm just saying that I do not find it right for me, and I suspect (as Josh's experience confirms it) there are many more of my ilk around. I want to find them and associate with them.
oh yes it's out! hi from a new reader to your blog from Denmark 🙂 thankyou for sharing I know one young man you have given hope!
There's a dating site out there that has (probably) thousands upon thousands of match questions.. You give your answer, as well as what answers you're willing to accept in a potential match.. as well as how important this question is to you in the first place.
One question stood out- about exposing children to sexuality. Um.. could we define "sexuality" first? Sure, there's lots of "inappropriate" sexuality out there (clothing ads anyone? maybe Desperate Housewives?) But what about seeing Mommy and Daddy hug or kiss- is that sexuality? Could be, and it would be AWESOME for kids to see that kind of appropriate sexuality. Seeing Mommy and Daddy flirt- more sexuality.. and again, I think it's good for kids to see the chemistry between their parents.
"Teach them correct principals and they govern themselves."
It applies to more than just mayorship of a town. It applies to the classroom, managing a home.. and yes, even sex ed. Talk to your kids about their bodies, and don't be afraid of it. They'll pick up on that fear. Be honest, be frank, be simple, be accurate, be clear.
I think the key is "age-appropriate".. and knowing your kids. Kudos to the Weeds for knowing their kids.. AND for following the Spirit in this. (OK, so I lied- two keys.)
Thank you for sharing. It is important that we love an serve one another and while I know this will change your lives, I hope and pray it will be for the better. Hiding is of the Adversary never from Heavenly Father.
I appreciate all you have said because we have a brother who is living a gay lifestyle and so many in the church are so judgmental that we haven't talked of him. We don't see him much because he lives far away but we love him.
In addition your blog post has given us an opportunity to have additional conversations with our daughters. Good open conversations. We need to think, ponder, process and choose who we are and who we want to be, each and every one of us. Thank you for sharing so many of us can think, ponder and choose.
It did go viral…I think because a lot of people are hungry for love and the promise of acceptance, respect, connection and real love. I read a lot of the comments to this blog and they seem generally supportive. I guess there must always be that one person out there who judges and thinks they know someone's true motives. Can I say, though, that for me…all of this has brought me closer to God. Closer than I've been in a long time. It's given me a hope I haven't had. And the topic of SSA doesn't apply to my situation…but what profoundly moved me was Josh and Lolly's relationship. True respect, friendship, support and encouragement. It takes a lot of courage to live authentically. Especially in the face of public opinion. Some will love you. Some hate you. And more will curse you. But joy is found in being true to yourself and any children will benefit from that.
I just found your blog and read your coming out post. It was beautifully written and incredibly touching, and a very interesting perspective. I am a huge proponent of gay rights, and an active member of a Christian church that openly welcomes and supports homosexuals; in that way my Christian experience is different than yours and I'll admit that my initial reaction, when I first started reading your post, was to feel sad – "Another example of Christian oppression of the gay community," I thought. As I continued to read, though, I was moved by your genuine, heartfelt explanation of the life you've built. You made me remember that acceptance and equality is about choices, and for some happiness will be the choice to continue on the traditional path. Thank you for broadening my horizons.
Hi! I am a new reader to your blog since I read your coming out post. I am a Mormon. I am in awe of your commitment to remain a faithful member of the church. Thank you for sharing your choices, experiences & this part of your life. I know it will be a benefit to others.
OMG! when did baby Tessa get so big?!?
First, I would like to say that I respect you and your courage. Second, I have to admit, I don't understand how a gay man has a "healthy and robust" sex life with woman, but to each their own and more power to you.
I would like to ask you a question. Before coming out, did you consider or did you and your wife discuss the inevitable repercussions that would follow from your church? By repercussions, I mean ex-communication, family and friends turning their backs on you. The church possibly trying to get your wife to leave you and take the kids with her. I ask because I am an ex-mormon who lived and was basically raised in Utah and was lucky enough to make it out. Though my situation was different from yours, I'm not gay and I chose to leave the church, the repercussions of losing friends and some family was difficult for me. I'm just wondering if that is something that you've prepared yourselves for.
Again, I think you are very courageous for this and admire you for that. I'm sure that this will serve to help quite a few people. Thank you.
Just a clarification: You can't be excommunicated if you've never done anything to break your covenants. There isn't any diciplinary action that could be made for simply having feelings or temptations. Everyone has them. As josh states, it's your actions that count.
While that is true, it won't stop him from being shunned. As I stated, I am an ex-mormon. I left by choice. I also left Utah by choice. One thing I have noticed is that mormons outside of Utah do seem to be of a different breed than those in Utah. It's been my experience that mormons outside of Utah tend to be more tolerant and accepting of others, while those in Utah are just horrible people.
Children not allowed to be friends because one of them isn't mormon, people being denied jobs because of not being mormon (yes, I know that that is discrimination and is illegal. They find ways around it.)Also, for a place full of mo's, they are always very concerned with what a stranger's religious beliefs are. I guess they have to make sure if the stranger is one of them or not. The ironic thing is that in SLC, the world headquarters, it's not nearly as bad. But, 50 miles south in the "Happy Valley" area of Orem/Provo it was stifling.
Wow! I am a Mormon who lives in Utah. Thank you for telling me I am a horrible person! I have tried to be very accepting of ALL people. You are making some very prejudice remarks. Open your mind just a little!
Sean:
Please don't stereotype Utah Mormons as "horrible people." I am a Utah Mormon– I am tolerant and accepting of EVERYONE. Please don't associate the people you had negative run-ins with with Utah Mormons. There are negative people everywhere– not just Happy Valley. Please keep an open mind and have faith that there are a lot of us Utahns who are great. Josh has been such an incredible example of kindness throughout this whole blog, and I think we should use the comment space that he's so generously offered to us in reciprocating the same kindness.
I'm a new reader, a FB friend linked your site. I'm an active married Mormon gal from the east coast. I loved reading your story and I think you and Lolly have an amazing relationship!! I wish you all the best. Thank you for sharing your lives with us!
Josh,
When I read your post "coming out", I felt a wide-array of emotions, like many of the people who commented. I don't have a problem with how you live your life, but I do have a problem with what people of certain faiths are trying to do to control the narrative about gay rights and equality in America.
Regardless of whether or not you say that your path is not necessarily one that you would recommend, endorse, suggest, or hold up as the model for other gay people, there are faith organizations with political motivations who DO want to use your life's path as an example of "how to deal with being gay". They even go so far as to call homosexual people Same-Sex Attracted (SSA) as though it's some kind of disease.
I grew up in Boston, MA. Massachusetts is a pretty great place for gay people to grow up. Was I bullied? Yes. Was I scared to come out? Not really. Whose business was it that I'm gay? Kids would ask me and I would just say, "I don't know." If they were rude about it, I'd smile and say, "Ask your father." Coming out to my parents was pretty easy. They were more upset that I'm a vegetarian rather than my gayness.
I have a wonderful life with a wonderful family. I have had wonderful relationships. Your post sometimes teeters on the edge of saying that you're somehow a "refugee" from homosexuality and I don't think you are. I just think you wanted something else, though you acknowledge that who you are as a gay man is certain.
So, since you've opened the can of worms and the National Organization for Marriage and Lifesite News are trumpeting your story as "living proof" of the "choice of homosexuality", I'd like to respond to you and to them.
So, what should we gay men, of faith or atheist, do? Hmm? Shall I pick out a wife and have kids? Will that make everyone feel better, more faithful, more American? I know, Josh, that you said you wouldn't prescribe your life choices as the magic pill to end homosexuality, but then why do you need to share this with America? To help with book sales? To counter the progress that the marriage equality movement has made? Do you realize how belittling your narrative can come off? I'm not unhappy, thank you very much. Of course, I have to laugh, since I probably sound a little unhappy right now.
I think you seem like a very likable and genuine person and I am happy that you have found happiness with your wife and kids. But I'm not going to let anyone tell me that I should have to deny myself the joy of knowing love from another man. When I am with my HUSBAND (not partner, not roommate, not traveling companion, not good friend), I am at the best that I can be because his love brings that out in me. I cannot find that with a woman and I do not want it. Your religion and your values are yours. I don't have to share them.
And regarding the point that as a homosexual you have to sacrifice something (your religion or your sexuality), that's what life is about, sacrifice. Every choice we make every day closes the door on other choices. The person we were born to be opens or closes doors, too. I don't need you to be in a relationship with a man to make me happy or to make me think you're a worthwhile person, so why do people who share your beliefs feel that way about me? That's what Jesus taught? Somehow I doubt that.
I guess your post makes me scared in some ways. What if this story continues to catch on? What if people in power positions think that gays should just deny their sexual attractions and choose a heterosexual lifestyle? Some already do. What if your story is used by people who are not as understanding of homosexuality as you are? How will you feel if the relationships of millions of people are invalidated by people's limited understanding of your story? What then?
I just want to love the man I'm with. I have no idea why that is so offensive to your church and your peers.
With all due respect to our heterosexual sojourners, I believe that any gay person, no matter what lifestyle is pursuing, as long as it is a lifestyle of integrity, devotion and love, and not of offense and destruction is essentially of the same lot. So, there could and should be some kind of an underlying solidarity, with only one, but very basic premise: no abuse because we are different.
Abuse of Josh's story in order to belittle or slander would be just that. Abuse.
That doesn't mean we need to agree about choices each individual gay person make. We can actually vehemently disagree, but still keep that underlying solidarity intact.
I believe that gay marriage success stories are abundantly present in our consciousness, just as are mixed orientation failure stories. Now it may be a time to balance the picture. If that would require defending the truth in stories of the past, so be it.
I have to say, why can't he come out. You did. He has every right to share his experience and I don't feel like he has some evil ulterior motive but rather he wants to be true to himself and create stronger more honest bonds with the ones that he loves…You don't need to let his choice to share freak you out– I get the sense that you're like "oh no! his choice is making me look bad and putting pressure on the gay community". Well in my book it's not and you don't need to fret. There will be haters (as I'm sure you've experienced) and there will be nutters that, as FG Mormon said, abuse his story, but so what? You know who you are, and you know who you love and that's all that matters because the haters are gonna hate (pardon my dorkiness) no matter what. All we can do is what we feel is right.
I was, and am, so inspired about your story. As a married, LDS female (almost 54 years old) with my best friend being an openly gay male (HE calls himself my BFF – best fag friend), it has opened up the eyes to my grown children, even my parents (all of whom are LDS also). Our whole family has adopted Jeff into our family (he is Jewish, not practicing, and lives with his partner of many years). My husband considers him a brother, my grandkids even call him Uncle Jeff – the youngest two say "we have two uncle Jeff's" as my husbands brother is also named Jeff.
I have been fascinated by your story, my sister-in-law sent it to me on facebook (I don't twitter, google, or any of that). I haven't been active in the church for about 15 years, but my husband (he's my 4th, I'm his first – he adopted my 3 kids as his own) and I were sealed in the temple after he joined the LDS faith. We are getting active again so that we may go to the temple with my son and daughter in law when they are ready. My girls are not active.
One of my reasons for staying inactive was the church's views on homosexuality. I have known many who have been ex-communicated for this, and I feel that is VERY WRONG. Some have committed suicide. I had a former bishop I could SWEAR is gay, but is married to a lovely woman, raised a family and has grandchildren. The church has come a long way in it's principles, and I feel very strongly that this needs to be changed also, even for those choosing to follow living with a person of the same sex. It is not a CHOICE, it is who one is – this "deprograming" thing is alot of bunk. Like I have been with chronic migraines and other severe medical issues. Was this a choice? No, I WAS BORN THIS WAY. THIS IS WHO I AM. Either accept me or move on.
You are one very great and courageous person. I don't know you or your lovely wife, but I love you and respect you and your sweet family for all you are, for all you have stood up to be, and for your COURAGE to write your article. I have signed up via email for your messages and have your blog in my favorits file. I live in Tucson, Arizona and would love to "adopt" you as my brother, as I have my friend Jeff.Your family would be more than welcome to become a part of ours, we are truly enriched and blessed with the friendship of our gay friends.
I find it fairly interesting that people are throwing around the theory that same-sex marriage will be accepted eventually based on the history of polygamy and blacks with the priesthood. They are completely different (though I do see the secular connections relating to civil rights).
My personal opinion on polygamy (and I could be waaaaaaaaay off base here so just take this with a grain of salt) is that it was an ancient practice that was restored with the restoration of the church, since all things had to be restored. I believe it was restored at that particular time because 1) it was legal, and 2) it was necessary to provide relief to many widows and children left by the violence facing the church in those early days. I also think there were probably several men "called" to be polygamist, but perhaps a larger following of people just doing it because they saw others doing it…. ? Might be wrong. Either way, it was an ancient practice restored for a short time in order to have restored all things.
And as far as the black receiving the priesthood, the church ALWAYS knew this would happen. In fact, I have read several places where church leaders prayed and prayed and prayed for the day to restore it. There were black members praying for it. There was a great desire to be able to extend it. And the day came. And looking from the outside, with a secular view, and with a bias that the church is just plain crazy and racist, then yes it looks like they bowed to outside pressure. But believing in the church and knowing the situations that happened inside the church (seeking for answers, knowing the history behind the inability to offer the priesthood, etc) it's a whole different ball game.
So comparing those 2 instances to same sex marriage doesn't really mean much to me. I, personally, cannot imagine the church changing positions (which doesn't mean they won't, I just don't see it). It's a core doctrine around which nearly every other belief in the church rotates. The church HAS supported civil unions, and HAS supported civil rights as far as employment and housing. But the fear, and a VALID FEAR, is that of religious persecution in changing the definition. You can argue all you want that the right of a church to dictate who they marry will remain theirs, but there is no way to anticipate what will happen as the constitution is continually reinterpreted and changed to fit current issues. Take the case of the private photography company being sued for refusing to take pictures of a same-sex commitment ceremony. Her rights should be upheld by the first ammendment, but the same-sex couple is suing for discrimination (which is ALSO to be upheld by the law). How can anyone foresee that there won't be a major lawsuit in years to come if marriage is redefined?
I would be fine if there were a separate recognition of civil unions. But I'm totally opposed to redefining a God-based ceremony. And really, if people want to leave God out of it, it should be called something else anyways.
So, Josh. On a totally unrelated lighter note… I first found your blog because of your coming out post. But I read some other posts and thought you were a good writer and that the posts were funny. So what did I do? I decided to Google "the weed blog" to read some more older posts. Turns out you only come up #2 with that search. The first hit is for a blog about marijuana. Go figure. I thought it was entertaining.
Your article was poignant and amazing and… don't take this the wrong way… "not weird." This could have been REALLY weird, drippy, preachy, defensive, and even judgmental. It was nothing but a beautiful breath of fresh air and so filled with love and understanding for all mankind; I've read it several times. Thank you for sharing your perspective. It has reconciled for me many thoughts that have buzzed around in my mind over the years. I'll be following The Weeds. I hope you find nothing but warmth and love from your neighbors and ward members. I hope you find acceptance and understanding from the gay community. Yeah, I think you are right that your lives have changed forever with this blog post. I pray the benefits and blessings of your decision to share your experiences with the world will always outweigh the challenges and anger that will come your way. I wish you the very best of luck on your journey!
I LOVE that you mentioned Brene Brown! I just found out about her, and think her work is nothing less than amazing. When I read your coming out post, I definitely saw a lot of Brene Brown in it, and now I know why. 🙂
Josh, you are the exception. Most commenters on here won't want to believe that I think because they feel so darn relieved that someone has offered a solution to homosexuality, as it were. And folks who are desperate will cling on to your story. You really seem like a lovely, lovely man. Really. But other than the relief that you offer folks who are tired of the 'gay agenda', your story does far more harm than good. This is the case no matter how many thousands of Mormons and a few other religion religious folks praise you. Some comment up there mentioned kids dying and it's true. Young folks are killing themselves because of the kinds of things you are promoting, the kind of relief you are offering people who are not only grossed out by homosexuality but believe that God hates it as well. you are absolutely not meaning to, I totally believe that, but your postings are going to increase the misunderstanding of sexual orientation, which will lead to more tortured young people and more suicide. This is true even though you say that straight marriage is not for all gay people, even then. It's your decision obviously but I beg you to stop..
– Fred
How do you know that Josh is an exception? I keep seeing people say this, and I want to know what their source is. How do you know that anyone who experiences same sex attraction but wants to make a traditional marriage work that is based on honesty like the Weed's is can't do so?
And lest you assume I am some religious zealot fixated on taking away the rights of gay people to love each other, I myself am gay and a big proponent of letting anyone love whoever they want to love.
I guess I just don't understand the need of people to tell anyone who they can or cannot love and marry. Isn't telling people they shouldn't marry someone of the opposite sex just as bad as telling people they shouldn't marry (or have a committed sexual relationship) with someone of the same-sex? It seems a little hypocritical to me. Aren't your fears that gay people will be persuaded to have a straight marriage by this just as false as fears that legalizing gay marriage will persuade more people to be gay?
You nailed it, ALRMCoug. Thank you.
How do you know there aren't young people committing suicide because they feel their only choice is to live something that is in direct contrast with their beliefs? The only solution to someone born gay is to then lose ALL OTHER CHOICES and just…. Be gay.
What if THAT'S the cause of suicide for some?
There are thousands and thousands of VERY vocal members of the gay community that offer their love and support… IF you choose to live a gay lifestyle. But, if you choose to rock the boat and not join their side… Well, that's fine, but just know that you're contributing to people killing themselves, because THAT choice is one that kills.
Really? A message of hope and love is actually a message that KILLS?
What if a young person has these feelings and doesn't want them? What if a young person commits suicide because the only message out there for them (that I've ever heard) is to just be gay? Embrace it! What if that goes against everything they believe in? I could see how that would cause suicides as well.
Why is it that we should all love and support a gay person as long as they live "true to themselves" by choosing a partner and fighting for marriage equality, but whatever you do DO NOT POINT OUT OTHER OPTIONS. No, because MORE options and MORE choices would be dangerous. The ONLY life saving choice is that of no choice. "It gets better…" if you do what you're told is the only option.
ALRMCoug is on to something. How do you know that there aren't a bunch of gay people that read his blog and thought "huh, interesting" and nothing more. And why do people keep pretending that Weed didn't explicitly say "I don't think this is a cure. I don't think this is for everyone" when he did. Probably because it's inconvenient for them.
As someone who had both same-sex attraction & suicidal thoughts & is Mormon & has wife and children, I can say this:
First and foremost cause of suicidal thoughts is the inability to face & accept the reality of same-sex attraction. If one persuades himself or herself (or if someone persuades them) that those feelings actually don't exist or are fake, mirage, self-deception, one is on the path of self-destruction. Josh has obviously never had a problem with that. In his own words, he was simply waiting "for the attraction to girls to set in", but when he realized that "the girl thing wasn't going to happen" and "the guy thing was totally happening", he simply went to inform his parents about it. Many people with same-sex attraction, when it sets in, are shocked, appalled, scared, confused, concerned and in denial. And that's bad. The first thing one can do in such a situation, as Josh repeatedly points out, is to say: "It is okay to feel that way." And then go on from there.
The next most important cause of suicidal thoughts is inability to face reaction of one's family and friends. It is closely related to the first, because, if a person was sure that nothing bad would happen if that piece of information is revealed to everyone, one would not have a reason to deny the reality of the attraction.
Then, I'm sure that suicidal thoughts could come (although, I've never had those) when a person with same-sex attraction chooses a lifestyle that is not right and proper for him or her. Wrong choices are typically made because of lack of courage to pursue his or her own personal path, whatever that path may be. Wrong choices are also made because one simply does not have a reference point to trust and to cling to, which would correspond to his or her inner value system.
In the gay universe, there are many good, honest, decent voices of help & support, but there are just as many deceiving, misleading and dishonest ones.
That's why I believe Josh's voice is of such a seminal importance. We simply haven't had anyone like him. Yes, if he didn't exist, he should have been created from scratch.
for any of you married and straight folk who say that really, sex is not that important a part of marriage, stop having sex entirely and see how that goes for you.
– Bob
I haven't had sex for 15 years (married 20) – as we get older, the desire often wanes. My husband and I sleep in separate rooms. He doesn't cheat, nor do I. This works out just fine for some of us.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it, Bob. It's childish to assume that your experience and desires are just "the way it is".
So, you posted something on a fairly small blog with a fairly small audience, AND…… it got big fast. Such is the nature of the internet. The nature of 10 minutes of fame. I know you didn't do this for political or larger-than-life agenda-changing reasons….. and chances are in this cynical world, that you won't last a long time in the spotlight. You may or may not want to be a spokesperson for gay mormons all over the world. Either way, currently you're in the spotlight. I wish you would use that small window of opportunity now- in a short post- to explain in greater detail, that your personal coming out story was not meant in any way to be a "cure" for homosexuals- or a solution to the gay "problem". I know your previous post said this already- but PLEASE, re-iterate it. There is a lot of love on your blog. There is also a LOT of reposting on other sites that you can't control right now that is blowing up in the blogosphere and news sources. It's not all pretty out there. Stand up while you have a spotlight and remind us not about you- but about how ALL gays are people, and how they are ok as God created them. Stand up now and say that people have rights no matter their orientations. Stand up now and say that you do believe that Mormons should be loving no matter what- and that you do not in any way push your personal path on other young gay boys/men/girls/women who are confused about how their future lines up with the church they are so deeply a part of.
There is a LOT of hate going around. Yours is a message of love. Stand up and say that again.
A lot of people did NOT hear what you said the first time, and have grossly misconstrued what you read and didn't read the whole thing, but now are taking it as a chance to blow up the whole issue in lots of harmful ways for gay christians.
Either stand in the spotlight now for what is right, or as Fred said above, please stop.
My read is that Joshua Weed is doing exactly that what you keep asking him to do.
Except, you may be asking him to put slightly stronger emphasis on the acceptance of same-sex relationship lifestyle?
Aren't there scores of people who do exactly that?
Why should he be doing what others do, if he is different?
Isn't it enough that he in no uncertain terms encourages everyone to love anyone with same-sex attraction, no matter what lifestyle they have chosen to pursue?
Why would it be important to emphasize a particular lifestyle in his endorsement, with which he does not necessarily agree?
And if he does not agree with it, does that make him less supportable, even if he clearly states that he loves the folks, no matter what?
Does his possible disagreement with certain gay lifestyles make him less authentic?
No kidding. If you don't endorse the "gay lifestyle", fair enough but you do have to be kind and tolerant both of which Josh is.
Tourettes.
Thanks for posting your story.
But inquiring minds do want to know – how do you, actually, get it up when you have "amazing" sex with your wife?
And does she ever discuss with you how it feels in not having a partner that is sexually attracted to her or turned on by her?
Is masturbation something you engage in? And what do you think of while masturbating?
Exactly!
Josh and Lolly,
I just wanted to say thank you. I am a Mormon and married to a gay man. We have been married for 23 years. We have two beautiful kids. We have been going through a rough time lately for lots of reasons, but mainly because of his sexuality. A few weeks ago, I was ready to file for a divorce, but he was so devastated, I agreed to keep trying. I must admit, I was hurt and not giving it my whole effort. My friend sent me your last blog post because she knew I was struggling with this issue. After I read your blog, I started crying and realized that love is worth fighting for and that sexual attraction is one thing, but love is something else entirely. Somehow hearing it from someone who was in the same situation and not just saying it because he loves me, made me realize the truth in my own life. Thanks to your honesty, courage, and love, I am giving love another chance. You have both changed my life, and I truly cannot thank you enough.
Tiffany
You are one brave woman! Never mind the hateful comments. I agree with you. You, and every one else who finds themselves in a similar situation is in my prayers.
Here! Here! Keep your chin up!
be brave and be honest and God will work it out
Tiffany, your husband has never ever been attracted to you and never will be. That's a lot for you to have to give up. Imagine being with a man who could love you completely. imagine that.
How is he not loving her completely?
You're a dickbag who doesn't even have the balls to NOT comment anonymously. Obviously they love each other and from that they have beautiful children. She has made her choice and so has he as to who they want to be with. And what, what did you think your stupid ass comment would do? What, would she secretly reply hoping that you'd send her a private email with your info so you two could meet and run away together? Get bent you douche nozzle.
First, Sean, what is a dickbag? Is it a bag of dicks? Do people have bags filled with dicks? Not where I live. "Oh, wait, I just have to go back in the house to get my dickbag." And what is a douche nozzle? Do they teach you this at church?
Anyway, poor Tiffany herself said she wants a divorce and is only staying because he begged her. Does she feel she is being loved completely?
Can you maybe chill on the insults and the anger directed at me, not sure why I deserve that. Josh himself asked people to be respectful on here. Cause also really, your anger and insults are not really drawing me to Mormonism I gotta tell ya. I'm not willing to get into a ridiculous argument with you here and it would be ridiculous because you so very quickly stoop to bizarre insults that don't even make sense. Maybe you need a little (or a whole lot of) cock up your ass. And as Betty white says and i paraphrase, why are balls considered such a sign of toughness? it's the vagina that takes the pounding. Don't be afraid, Sean, embrace your need for cock. God will still love you even while you're going down on a big hairy guy.
I love the fact the you automatically assume that I am gay and religious. I am neither. In fact, I am an ex-mormon that does not believe a single word of their doctrine. I am also a heterosexual that is and has been in a serious relationship with a woman for quite some time. My insults to you come from the fact that your comments have nothing to offer; whether it be support or a thought provoking debate in opposition of his view. Plus, you like to hide yourself in anonymity.
But, more importantly, I have seen first hand how religion can turn families and friends against each other and cause nothing but detrimental outcomes. Combine that with the fact that I have several friends whom I care for greatly that are gay and, because of that, I do take this personally and feel the need to stand up and take his side.
But, that's ok. You continue to hide anonymously and make your witty remarks on slang terms and throw out comments that offer nothing but a look into your own closed-mindedness and bigotry. Oh, and good job on the balls vs vagina discourse, though it was Hal Sparks who did the 5 minute routine that made that famous.
I am sorry you have so much anger! And, religion that is based on truth does not turn families and friends against each other, it turns them to one another. Truth is truth whether you believe it or not.
Who ever wrote this….sounds like you have some pain related to this topic…I hope you find healing…
You don't know me from Adam but I want to say thank you. Thank you for sharing your story and doing it with such love, tolerance, and compassion for those you knew would read it. As someone who is LDS and has grown up with a certain view of this issue I always fell so torn about my beliefs. Whenever I have expressed them I am either attacked by my LDS or my gay friends. That the end of your post allowed me point blank to work out my feelings about it without feeling like a horrible person made such a difference. I could feel your forgiveness for my less than supportive thoughts and your love for the things I have already figured out. There is nothing more Christian than that sort of kindness and love. You are my heroes and not because you came out (the more I think about it the more secondary that is) but because you did it with such love and exceptance of all the other people out there. It is one of the most unselfish things I have ever seen. I hope someday be as brave and Christ like as you two are as a couple. My God bless and keep you.
So when your having all this "robust sex" your not thinking about a hot guy and a big dick at all right??? Ya, that's what I thought.
Judging from the site that you linked to, you are a right wing fundamentalist which means you are the problem not the solution. Seriously, I don't get these people who feel the need to leave these comments; "oh you think about big dick!", etc. If you disagree with him or his views try to form a comment that takes a little more than a 7th grade mentality and try to encourage some discourse. Otherwise, you're just another dipshit that hates in the name of their god.
Wow Sean, you've seem to make it your business to comment on anyone that post's anything other than puppies and sunshine on the topic.. You seem pretty personally involved. I'm guessing your story must be quite similar then.
Quite frankly – I think the post from get real, makes a very valid point.
No, I'm not personally involved, but I will take a stand against those who feel that bigotry and intolerance is acceptable. Especially against those who do so in the name of their god.
Poor Sean, no guy would hook up with him, so this is all he has to do.
And I suppose no married man in history has ever fantacized about another woman during sex. Who cares? I mean, Im unmarried and think about penis all the time! Thats just as "wrong" is it not? Its kind a moot point. If they have intimate time, if they are skilled at getting each other off (sorry, thats blunt) then really who cares.
@anonymous – I guess you missed the comment above where I replied that I am not gay, but a strong supporter of gays because of the many gay friends I have that I care about. But, you go ahead and keep cracking your gay jokes because that is, apparently, all you can bring to the table in this discussion.
Poor Sean, no guy would hook up with him, so this is all he has to do.
again, see above……
"but I will take a stand against those who feel that bigotry and intolerance is acceptable."
and
"Especially against those who do so in the name of their god."
This is incredibly ironic.
How is that ironic? Assumptions about my sexual orientation and religious views have been made in these comments. Is it not only fair to practice in kind? What is one to think when there are comments about Josh fantasizing about "big dick" and me needing a "cock up my ass"? That doesn't sound bigoted to you, anonymous? And, can you say without any doubt that those who leave those types of comments are not bigoted towards gays based on their own religious views?
Whether Josh is thinking about someone else or not does not seem to be the point of Get real's comments. Rather, it seems is point is to somehow discredit Josh's message. That is what Sean is reacting to. Motives are tricky though, none of us know for sure what Josh's motives are or what Get real's motives are:
I don't Like Your Motives …Well, not the ones I've Decided You Have!
http://reasonable-thought.blogspot.com/2012/05/i-dont-like-your-motives-well-not-ones.html
Josh, I was really impressed with your coming out post and how respectful you were of others who might choose a different path. But I'm a little concerned to discover that you seem to be affiliated with a place dedicated to reparative therapy. Can you post something about your affliation with lifestar and explain what your position is on reparative therapy?
http://www.lifestarwashington.com/staff.php
Thank you so much for making this part of your life public. I do not know you, but have so much love and respect for you and your courage. It will surely change the lives of many. I do have a question and it may have already been asked (I haven't read the comments). I apologize if this question sounds ignorant or crude as that is not my intention. To have a sexual relationship and procreate, obviously we all know what goes on. How is it possible to become "aroused" and able to have intercourse, when you are not attracted physically to your spouse? I know there are other forms of attraction, but a major part of arousal IS physical whether we want to admit it or not. This goes for a couple who is heterosexual, but one or both partners have lost physical attraction for the other. It seems thoughts may have to be directed somewhere else, or to someone else to get that arousal. I
"Rainbows, unicorns, flowers, lambs, DECAPITATED BABY, clouds, sunshine." Oh man that made me laugh…. really hard. Yea, there's always going to be those crazies out there. No point in letting them ruin a good thing 😀 You guys are doing an amazing thing. Keep on going and keep being true to yourselves 😉
Just LOVE YOU BOTH! Yeah, I'm a fan, and was guilty of spreading your post over the weekend! I didn't want to be one of the thousands to keep you two from celebrating and not relaxing in the pool, so I'm now going to say, I'm SO impressed and touched with all you shared and how you did it so womderfully! I'm so happy for you. I am a mommy of a beloved daughter who has had her trials, and will probably for this life. It took me a few years to get over my sadness (of her choice to leave the church that she loved, that she brought many into and that she had such a huge, contagious testimony of, to feel she had to be who she is, etc). But I have loved her, and have a huge supportive family who still includes her. Thank you for letting others know that ALL young or old people with this difficult life need love, most of all! Can't wait to read more about your adorable family. That cute daughter that takes after her daddy (youtube video) still has me LOLing! GO YOU!!!
Im jealous of your writing skills. Who would think an english nerd could use that type of major/skill for something so important and impactful(google is telling me that's not a word and Im giving google the middle finger). Sure, there's more to it than that, but really. Im jealous. Its well done. Which is almost as important as the subject.
I've read through many of the comments on this post. I'm sorry that not everyone understands your post. I'm sorry that some people can't see that this was a description of your own personal history based on a choice that works for you. You have shared a small piece of your individual journey. I'm sorry that some people feel threatened by your message. Even with all of the love, openness, and acceptance that you expressed and obviously feel for the choices of others, some people will always take it the wrong way. Some people will always feel "judged" by someone who is making a different choice in their own life circumstances. It's very intolerant, in my opinion.
Don't let the haters get you down. Your family is amazing.
Who are the ones REALLY causing the inner turmoil among our friends struggling with SSA? Maybe you should turn the tables. The gay movement tells people that if you have SSA then you better just embrace it, love it, and live it, right? Gay pride, right? But what if you are like Josh, and other than a sexual appetite, attraction, etc for men, you have ZERO desire to be gay? Where is the voice for you? Everywhere around you, you are hearing that you just need to accept it.
What Josh had given is FAR from damaging. What he has reminded us, is that life is a CHOICE! We do not have to be governed by our bodies or sexual appetites, WHATEVER they might be. His is s story of hope. It says, guess what? You can CHOOSE to be WHATEVER you want to be. And THAT is a story of hope.
Life is full of trials. And as Josh so eloquently pointed out, we trade good for better and better for best. It's about opportunity cost for people. We make choices at the expense of other choices all day long. What he has given the world is a new voice. And, I dare say, it has been an important one.
Bravo, Josh, bravo. AGENCY is divine and powerful.
I'm pretty sure that the "gay movement" does not acknowlede the term "SSA". It's called GAY!
But being gay or SSA is about more than just sex. It's about everything that you have or want in an opposite gendered person. and since you donn't have to CHOOSE, why should they other than I guess the fact that you believe they will burn forever in a pit of fire. There is that loving bit of information, tis true.
So true Bjorge Queen…..
Um, totally off subject… But did you know that now you are #1 search on google? Just sayin' 😀
Um, totally off subject… But did you know that now you are #1 search on google? Just sayin' 😀
All right. I have read your story and am seriously impressed with you, but here is my question: If you live a great and loving heterosexual lifestyle, why do you ever need to tell your girls anything different? Well, now you do since you decided to go public with it. As you stated, they can do any google search when they are older and find out, plus with so much of the world now knowing your story, they are sure to hear it somewhere. So why did you do it? Why not protect your own children? No one needed to know about something you've already worked out with yourself, spouse and god. Just something I was thinking about. I guess it would be like my dad coming to me and telling me he was an alcoholic even though he'd never had one drink. No reason I'd ever need to know that! Thank you for your willingness to read comments and answer questions.
Tera, I completely disagree. Wouldn't you be inspired to live an honest,faithful, strong life like your dad? If he came to you and told you he was an alcoholic? And obviously Josh thought about what he was doing A LOT.
Wow, Betty got that comment from Hal! Cool. I like Hal but his constant "I'm not gay" commments he felt compelled to make when he was filming QAF got really really tiring. Yes, Hal, we know you are straight.
Anyway, Sean, I agree with you – religion can be so destructive and the whole anti-gay movement in the Mormon Church (the primary movers behind pro prop. 8)is all rather horrifying.
Not sure what you mean about being 'bigoted toward gays' – meaning prejudice against gay people? Because my point is so the opposite of that – i agree with Fred up above – what Josh is doing, even though he is a super duper nice guy, ultimately advances the anti-gay 'agenda' and will inevitably result in more suicides in young people who are struggling with their sexual orientations. No, I am not saying Josh is directly causing this but it will be used to put forward even more anti-gay stuff which will down the line result in more suicides. I don't know, sean, seems we also share some free-floating anger that has to go somewhere, so it comes out here at each other. I'll stop that if you will. Let's stick to the points we are making and not the insults (and i include myself in that obviously). otherwise, folks won't hear at all what we have to say and just write us off as angry nutballs in order to still feel the great relief that there is another choice! young people don't have to jump off of a bridge, no! Josh has shown another way.
Agreed
Wow, what you are saying is FAR more damaging!! I almost thought you were serious in the end and then realized you were in jest. But it's the truth. He HAS shown another way. Who are you to tell someone that they HAVE to live one way? That the only answer for a gay person is ONE answer? What a LIMITED perspective you have. What a DAMAGING perspective you have. If it worked for him, it could work for someone else too. If you DONT WANT TO LIVE A GAY LIFESTYLE you don't have to. It's your choice. Why are you trying to rob people of making their own choices. As far as I'm concerned, it's people with your limited perspective that are damaging society. There is no such thing as one way. Each person has to live according to their own conscience, what feels good and right to them.
How about concentrate on furthering the HUMAN movement, rather than the gay movement or the anti-gay movement. What Josh has done is HARDLY going to cause more suicides! What he has said is if you don't want to live a gay lifestyle, DON'T.
Choose whatever you want to do and do it. This is a powerful message for ANYONE. And one of great hope. The HUMAN movement is furthered when we choose our own path, the one that resonates within us. The one that we feel right about.
Those people who don't WANT to live a gay lifestyle but are attracted to people of the same gender have someone to look to and say, "Hey, there isn't just one way." Let ALL voices be heard. The MORE voices, the better off everyone will be.
The ONLY dangerous voices are the ones hating and silencing. SPEAK! Good job, Josh!! You opened more doors for people with your blog.
I've been following this story since the day it broke. I was touched and inspired by your message. My horizons were broadened and I felt my love for humankind expand. It even helped me evaluate the strengths and weaknesses in my own heterosexual marriage. I've continued to follow your story through comments and articles and I have found myself bewildered by the "controversy" that has ensued. I thought we were supposed to be accepting of all people and their choices and lifestyles? Why is it that your unique and brave choice is fueling such vitriol and ridicule? Why is your success considered dangerous? Why are you not afforded the same love and acceptance for your own choices that you offer others for theirs? Just because you make different choices as a gay man??? How can people accuse you of not being "true to yourself" when it is obvious that you love yourself, are not ashamed of gayness, and have chosen to build your life in fidelity to a woman, your own biological children, and adherence to a religion that obviously fills you with joy and a sense of your divine worth? Clearly, you ARE being true to yourself in the most sincere form of the world. I think it's cruel for others to assign ulterior motives to your plain and clear message. You know your own heart and have done your best to express it in a most eloquent way.
I can only imagine how conflicted you must feel in this fiery furnace. There are so many that have been influenced for good and changed forever by what you have shared. There will always be fringe elements on both "sides" that will try to tear you down. You are a special family and I think you are great.
Excommunication is an act of LOVE. Not an act of silence. It is an opportunity, not a damning of the soul.
I just did some corrections to my post that is the only reason I removed it . But here it is in it's entirety.
MELISSA
Do you know that there are gay couples that are Mormon that would love the church to be fully accepting of them, but the church chooses to excommunicate?
Yes it's a great love story but behind their story are the stories of many that would love to stand in church and testify of their unique family but can't because the church teachings do not allow it. Don't you think that the church should recognize our divine worth? But the sad truth is they don't. They would rather have us sit there in silence as if our journey really has no connection to God, our Creator
Clearly we are also being true to ourselves by saying we are gay or being in gay committed marriages, oh wait, we can't say marriage because the church won't recognize that either.
How can we also adhere to a religion that obviously fills us with joy but then says we will only accept you if you choose celibacy by not acting on your homosexual feelings or if you choose to marry a woman even though you’re gay?
I too would love to have children that are biological, but even those of us who can't do so realize that any child that may come through adoption is also a blessing from God.
I am not ashamed of my gayness so why is the church? I have chosen to build a life of fidelity with a man, but the church will only love us, but not recognize our unique families. I would love to say I have biological children, and some do, but adoption is a blessing .
I am asking you this question: is there anything wrong with us wanting the same rights that Josh and his wife are afforded in the church and in society? Is there?
Would it be wrong of us to have the rights to share our love and unique family in testimony meeting?
Sadly the church uses its outdated practice of excommunication to try and keep us silent.
It turns away some, but there are also those who walk BRAVELY into church every Sunday who sit there in silence but have even stronger testimonies then ever before, whose faith was never taken away, and who's connection to God is even stronger.
I too want everyone to be accepting of all people’s choices and lifestyles, but in the case of the Mormon church and others, they are not. Why is our unique and brave choice still fueling vitriol and ridicule?
It's all because the world is not perfect, but it is changing.
I sit here today and openly say that I am praying that Josh and his family’s story continues to inspire people, but I also pray that it opens up more communication on the fact that a heterosexual marriage doesn't SOLVE or is the KEY to any gay youth that is struggling with their homosexual feelings.
I ask the universe, God our father and creator, to continue to guide all of us on our special journeys and that we all find peace and healing whatever we all may believe.
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/lifestyle/50729998-80/fehr-isaiah-lds-says.html.csp
http://mormonexpression.com/2011/02/08/111-steven-fehr/
I've re-written this 3 times trying to get it to sound right, but it's not happening.
How can you believe in a church that professes to receive modern revelation (i.e. revelation on things pertaining to current issues) through a prophet of the Lord (i.e. someone who communicates with the Lord) if you don't believe in it's teachings? Do you think the prophet is simply confused ON THIS ONE ISSUE? You can believe in everything else (enough that you want to participate in testimony meeting), but NOT THIS ONE THING?
I really don't understand that with the LDS church. I can understand it with other churches who feel like the heavens are closed and God only spoke to those in ancient times. But to feel like that with the LDS church you would have to think one of a handful of things.
1) There is no modern day revelation.
2) The prophet and/or presidency uses his position to push his own biased agenda.
3) The prophet is maybe unworthy and unable to receive revelation.
4) The prophet HAS received revelation, but is confused and doesn't understand God's REAL intention.
In any of those are true, then you don't REALLY believe in the church.
Again, I can see it with other religions where no modern revelation is believed in and it's simply man's interpretation of God's will. But I don't see how it's possible for a person to SAY they believe in, have a testimony of, want to fully participate, in a church when that person has to completely change the basic structure of the church in order to believe in it.
– Also, the church DOES recognize your divine worth, as in role of a child of God and someone who is loved by Him. I have never heard anything taught by the church differ from this.
– The church has also said that marriage will not solve the problem and could end up in broken homes.
Seriously, I have never heard anything but love expressed from the pulpit, though I do realize it's harder to put into practice when you're dealing with different groups having such strong opinions ON BOTH SIDES. But difference of opinion DOES NOT = hate, or "having no divine worth". It simply means difference of opinion.
Hey, Anonymous,
I appreciate your reply to my partner’s comment, and I appreciate the thoughtfulness with which you’ve worded it. I assume you genuinely want answers to your questions, so let me see if I can share things with you from my point-of-view. You ask the question, “How can [one] believe in a church that professes…modern revelation…if [one doesn’t] believe in its teachings?” You know, I guess this is the great dilemma of anyone who grows up gay and Mormon. Some choose to stay true to the church’s teachings, but sometimes sacrifice the joy that might come from a same-sex relationship. Many remain celibate and alone; others are in unfulfilling or unhappy marriages; and others, like Josh, perhaps, find something that evidently works for them. Other people find they must leave the church because they cannot figure out how to reconcile their sexuality with their religion.
Boyd K. Packer gave a rather notorious talk in General Conference in October of 2010 where he said, “Some suppose that they were preset and cannot overcome what they feel are inborn tendencies toward the impure and unnatural. Not so! Why would our Heavenly Father do that to anyone? Remember, He is our Heavenly Father.”
In his mind, because the LDS Church is true and because homosexuality is a sin, Packer feels there is no way to reconcile the belief that homosexuality can’t be overcome with the teachings of God, and that belief is what is so hard for those of us who are gay. I spent much of my life living according to the commandments of God and my sincere beliefs that the LDS Church is God’s true church on earth. I served faithfully in my callings, paid my tithes, attended church faithfully, went to the temple, served a faithful mission, bore my testimony, served others, prayed, fasted, worshipped, and felt the Spirit strongly in my life.
At the same time, however, I’ve always been gay and in trying to suppress or control or eradicate that part of myself, I experienced much misery. I always felt that in trying to live faithful to the commandment to not act on my homosexual attractions, I was living a façade, and I felt very joyless in life. No amount of praying or fasting or serving or living righteously helped me overcome my same-sex attractions, and the thought of living a life alone or in living in a false marriage was terrible (nor would I want to put myself or a woman in such a position).
But I have loved the church and I have felt of its divinity. Unlike Elder Packer, I have reached a different conclusion in my life. Because it wasn’t until I came out and fell in love with my partner that life finally felt happy. The joy the Church always taught me to strive for wasn’t found until I finally allowed myself to be who I always felt I was, but was afraid to be because the Church told me not to pursue that course.
Yet, I still can’t deny that I have felt the Spirit testify to me of the truthfulness of the Church. So I still believe, but I absolutely cannot feel in my soul that my being gay is wrong. In allowing myself to finally fall in love with the beautiful man that is my partner and in finally allowing myself to just live life as a gay man, I have experienced so much happiness and fulfillment and a closeness to God that I never knew possible. And I feel very strongly that He blesses our love. But I also can’t deny that I have felt the Spirit tell me the Church was true, so how does one reconcile that? I want to still believe the LDS Church is true, but I know my relationship with my partner and being true to who I feel I am has given me so much happiness, and if “wickedness never was happiness,” then this can’t be wicked. (Continued in next post)
I have always felt the leaders of the Church do not understand this issue from a gay person’s point-of-view, and often church leaders’ words come across as ignorant of the realities we, as gay people, face. I believe the leaders of the Church are good people, well-intentioned people, but as inspired men, they often do not seem to know how to help or counsel gay people in a way that fits with our reality, and that has always been difficult.
I also know many gay people, including myself, who have felt the Spirit just as strongly tell us it’s okay to be who we are and live the kinds of lives we live as we felt the Spirit testify to us of the Church’s truthfulness. It’s so easy to say, “Well, the Prophet says to do this,” but when I truly feel God telling my heart that being gay is not bad or evil and that loving someone is not wrong or evil, it’s hard not to accept the personal revelation God has given me over the faith that someone who doesn’t seem to understand my situation, be he a prophet or not, knows what’s best for me. I trust that my Heavenly Father knows what’s better for me than anyone, and so I have pursued the path I’m on and have never regretted it.
I do not think the leaders of the Church are perfect men. I think them good men, spiritual men, prayerful men, but they also make mistakes. I also think that revelation is a continual thing. I think there is much about mortal life and God’s ways that no one knows, including the Prophet of the Church, and I believe things are continually revealed line upon line, precept on precept, and perhaps homosexuality is one of those issues.
I don’t claim to have all the answers. I don’t claim to always be right about things. I do know I still very much love my Mormonism, although I have been excommunicated, and I know that I love my life with my partner and that it has brought me the greatest joy I have ever known. I try to reconcile those two seemingly contradictory things the best I know how.
I do not think the prophet a bad or misguided man, nor do I find him unworthy. I do not pretend to know what God has revealed to him on this matter or what he will reveal. I only know what he has revealed to me, and I am trying to live my life the best I can based on that.
I want to still believe the Church is true, but if I have to give up one over the other, I will choose the life I have now and the relationship I have with my husband over the Church because it is a testimony to me of God’s love for me and of the happiness he has blessed me with. Yet I also can’t let go of what I feel he has revealed to me about the Church. If that seems a contradiction, all I can say is it is what I have felt
I don’t know if that adequately answers your queries. Probably not. But it is the best answer I can give you. Life is complicated. I don’t think the simple Sunday School answers always adequately address the real issues that people like me feel and experience every day.
I don’t believe members or leaders of the Church hate gay people, but I have heard words said in ignorance from pulpits and in Sunday School and Priesthood lessons that have been hurtful and less than kind. I think many members don’t have a full understanding of who gay people really are, and in their zeal to proclaim the gospel they sometimes say and do things that push their gay brothers and sisters away.
My partner and I just love each other like I imagine a heterosexual couple love one another, and I fail to see anything wicked or wrong with our relationship, and that’s what makes it hard to stay committed to a religion that does not seem to value who we are.
Like you say, there are strong opinions on both sides. I think the key is to just love each other without judgment, and let God sort out the rest.
Thanks for giving me the opportunity to share my thoughts.
StevenF, I am a gay Mormon, married in temple, with three kids of my own. And I am a convert, baptized in the church at the age of 29, not until AFTER I reconciled that gay relationship won't work for me.
You are posing a very important question for Mormons. How to reconcile a decision to pursue gay relationship to it's fullest with the membership of the church? Well, Josh explains it poignantly: "One of the sad truths about being homosexual is that no matter what you decide for your future, you have to sacrifice something. […] But with homosexuality, the choices seem to be a little bit more mutually exclusive."
And that is especially true with homosexual Mormons, I would add.
Then, what are the options?
If a gay Mormon decides to pursue a gay relationship while still believes in the church and it's leaders, it may be appropriate to understand excommunication not as a punishment, but as an opportunity.
Excommunicated Mormons are welcome to the meetings. I would argue that the real change within the church related to gay issues can only come from those who would pursue church activity to the greatest extent possible for non-members, "dry Mormons". I would also argue that a route of a political or social pressure would probably lead us nowhere.
I'm not saying that it is comparable, but my understanding of a change of sentiment about blacks & priesthood among the brethren began when many faithful Saints from Brasil who were of black descent immensely contributed to the building of the Sao Paulo temple, with the full knowledge that they might never be able to participate in ordinances performed there.
It is my dream that gay Mormons, particularly those in gay relationships, actually influence the church by regular attendance.
One may argue that such a sacrifice is perhaps too much to expect from someone who might have greatly suffered under church policies and practices related to gay population, and I may agree. Still, I believe there is no better way to tackle the issue, except from within.
Hey, FG Mormon,
Thanks for your thoughts. I actually agree with Josh that no matter how gay Mormons choose to live their lives, whether in or out of the church, in a gay or straight relationship, or alone, we all sacrifice something. In my case, I do sacrifice full fellowship in the LDS Church, and while in an ideal world, I would love to have both my membership and my relationship with Isaias, my relationship with Isaias has brought me so much joy and happiness and well-being that the sacrifice is worth.
There are those like you and Josh who may be sacrificing a same-sex relationship for what you have chosen, and it would appear the sacrifice is worth it to you. I think each person has to decide the sacrifices they are willing to make and search for happiness wherever they can find it.
But it's true – what are the options? Unlike my partner, I've never viewed excommunication as a punishment. Isaias and I choose to disagree about the purpose and/or usefulness of excommunication, but one thing we do agree on is that too many genuinely good people who could contribute much to the church are being excommunicated and denied full fellowship. While it's true that our actions have caused this, I still don't understand why my loving someone of the same sex is considered such a sin. It does not make sense to me. Yet I understand that is what the Church teaches, and I accept that.
I think most excommunicated members, unlike me, choose to drift away from the Church rather than stay and partake with limited participation, and I think that is the Church's loss. I understand the Church's need to protect itself from those who are excommunicated who might lead members of the Church astray or teach false doctrine. I, myself, would never try to instigate my political leanings or say anything subversive in a church setting. I just wish I could comment in class or bear my testimony or give a talk or a public prayer once in a while. Again, I understand that my own actions have denied me those privileges, but I fail to see how limiting my participation helps either me stay connected to the Church or helps the Church. I find it ironic that active members of the Church, for example, can say any ignorant or unintentionally hurtful thing they want, but I, who have many valuable things to say, must remain silent.
That being said, I've always felt welcome at church. Many in my congregation know I have been excommunicated and have treated me no differently than they ever did. But I certainly don't feel as connected to the Church as I once did, and I think the consequences of my excommunication (not my relationship with Isaias, mind you, but the rules regarding excommunication) have pushed me farther away from the Church, simply because I feel I don't really have as much of a place or value there anymore.
But one reason I continue to go is that my being there is a testimony by itself of who I am and what I stand for; that my being gay or having a homosexual relationship has not diminished my spirituality, my relationship with God, or changed the essence of who I've always been. And I hope I influence people's perception in a positive way of what it actually means to be gay; that being gay and loving God are not in opposition.
I don't know what the future holds for gay members (or former members) of the Church, but the Church is losing too many good people because of this issue, and they are not apt to get them back if things don't change. I'm not even talking doctrine; I'm talking perceptions, attitudes, and behaviors. I think it's already happened. Attitudes and rhetoric have even changed a lot just in the last 20 or 30 years, and I think things will continue to change and progress. It will be interesting to see what happens.
But I agree that working from within in very beneficial. I appreciate your taking the time to respond to my comment and for the opportunity you've given me to share some of my feelings.
Love these types of comments/conversations, by those who really understand from experience what it means to be gay and Mormon. I especially loved your line that said "And I hope I influenced people's perception in a positive way of what it actually means to be gay; that being gay and loving God are not in opposition." May I just add that being gay and being loved BY God are not in opposition?
I am a heterosexual, devout Mormon. This topic has drawn me in completely and I find myself thinking about it often. It is opinions of those like you (and Josh) which give me the most clarity…ie reconciling my beliefs of God's eternal plan with what I now perceive (and have not always, admittedly) as an attraction that some are born with, for the same gender.
I still don't know what the answer would be for allowing those in your situation to be fully welcomed in an LDS congregation in full fellowship, but I think these conversations will help us to get there.
I wish you would be my friend. I have such a hard time explaining to people that I am friends with everyone. If I have friends that do drugs it doesn't mean that I do (which is what everyone thinks). And though I wish they would find things that make them actually happy instead of moments of a high, I still love them and want good things for them. Even my husbands Ex who seems to hate me, I wish we could be friends because I know that she is a really nice person as long as you did't marry her ex. I think you are fabulous! Even with your sneaky eye and poop jokes. 🙂 And I wish I could find a way to verbalize things they way you do. Sometimes I'm trying to say saomething like, I love you and want this good thing for you, but all they hear is Why don't you do this? It is very hard…. This life thing is hard… I wish I had a friend like you that understands it a little better then I do.
Good luck with everything. I hate to think how life might change for your sweet family – especially those little girls. I don't know why some knowledge really gets people going…sigh. But I think you've been incredibly brave (I'm afraid I admit I wonder why you did it, when you are 'living the dream' so to speak…lol) But anyway – I think you and your wife are amazing and I wish you luck and guidance!!!
Best of luck to you and your beautiful family. Honesty is the best policy.
WOW! – I didn't know they had Cafe' Rio in Washington 😀 Yippee
You have meticulously avoided stating whether or not you think gay relationships are acceptable, or whether you support legalizing gay marriage. I think it's fantastic that you've found a loving marriage with a woman, but I've got to tell you as a fellow gay man, I've got a loving marriage with my husband and our son. So I guess what I want to say is this: I am stating right here and now that I completely respect your decisions and I'm so happy for you in finding your soulmate. Are you will to say the same to me?
As someone who is gay Mormon in a heterosexual marriage with a loving wife and three children of my own, I feel urge to add my comment here.
I respect your decision to enter in a committed gay relationship. I am glad that you are happy. I believe we can be friends.
There is, however, something that you haven't asked of me, and if you haven't asked it because you care less, I am all with you.
I haven't been asked to condemn practice of my church of excommunicating people like you.
I assume that you are not a Mormon, have never been a Mormon, and have no plans to become one. Thus, you care less, and I'm utterly fine with that.
Now, the question may be whether my endorsement of your lifestyle could be considered honest and authentic if at the same time without a second thought I would have you ousted from the membership of my church if you were a Mormon? (Notice that I mention "membership", not "attendance". You are more than welcome to attend services any time you choose as a friend.)
So, if you care less, bingo. We can be not just friends, but very good friends. You can even try to have me converted in your religious or philosophical views. I love discussing deep issues.
Now, some Mormons who struggle with the same-sex attraction, as well as some of their advocates, do not care less. They think that my support of excommunication of someone like you can be construed as an act of overt hostility, and lack of love and compassion.
Other Mormons who struggle with same-sex attraction think that by endorsing your gay lifestyle I commit a sinful act, and support evil in the world. They may even believe that I sin because I have same-sex attraction myself.
For the latter, I care less. For the former, I care to the extend that I would like them to understand why I have such a disposition. But, since I assume that you care less, the explication of that disposition here and now is optional.
I'm not Mormon, but I am Catholic. I attend church with my family just about every week. Though it's unspoken, the Jesuits in charge of my church have no problem with our lifestyle. I wonder what we would do if someone tried to get us thrown out. I don't know if I'd be offended, so much as saddened by the loss of a lovely community of fellow worshippers.
Am I offended by excommunications of gay Mormons and Catholics? Not really. I think that it's the right of any religious organization to act according to its conscience. However, I do not afford the government that luxury. I guess that's my response: I can accept the Mormon Church excommunicating gays and lesbians, but I cannot fathom why it has spent millions of dollars trying to deny gay people a legal right completely unrelated to the religious rites of a church.
Thank you, James. Now, what is government? If you boil it down to the core, it is a monopoly of force. So, if, for example, Obamacare requires of the Catholic church to pay coverage for contraceptive pills to Catholic nuns, that's forcing collective (51 percent) views on a particular, private group.
The Mormon church obviously has a strong stance on traditionally defined marriage. They consider it essential to it's theology. We can discuss whether that stance is proper, correct, congruous or not, but no respecting person would wish to force opposite view upon it.
I agree that by actively supporting Prop 8, the Mormon church actually undertook the path of least resistance. The more principled way would be to engage in an effort to deny government a power and prerogative to define or perform marriages. Only private parties and organizations, including churches, should be allowed to do that. Government should be out of marriage business altogether. Instead, it should only uphold, by force, decisions of those private parties, no matter what those decisions are.
But, it seems that the government adores the idea of poking it's nose in every conceivable business of private parties, including marriage. Moreover, ill intentioned individuals take every opportunity to use government (defined as a monopoly of force) to enforce their own views upon others. That is what I believe the Mormon church is particularly concerned about, and that based on a few important historic precedences between the church and the state.
So, the church took the opportunity with Prop 8 and stirred that monopoly of force in a direction favorable to her. As I said, that may not be the most principled stance, but concerning circumstances, it was most realistic in terms of success and alleviation of the pressure of the government upon the church.
Frankly, I believe that Prop 8 will be ultimately overturned and gay marriages will be recognized nationwide. That will put the legislative pressure on churches in general, including the Mormon church, to accommodate gay couples. It remains to be seen how they will respond to that pressure.
But it is a fact that with that pressure, an additional measure of diversity will be lost. Government is all about uniformity, I'm afraid.
As a bystander here, I'm wondering about those who are gay and who are also married. I cannot but to think about your wives (since most of the time most of you talk about yourselves and leave the question of your better half’s outside of conversations) and was wondering how they are coping with your decisions. I know that Lolly knew for years what Josh was about but I would guess your wives didn't have that precious time to deal with it. I don't know how I would react in a circumstance like this, but I imagine it must be hard for them. My opinion is that it wasn't only you who 'sacrificed' something when you got married even though you were gay, but they must have 'sacrificed' some dreams of their own as well when marrying you. Or am I wrong?
As a bystander here, I'm wondering about those who are gay and who are also married. I cannot but to think about your wives (since most of the time most of you talk about yourselves and leave the question of your better half’s outside of conversations) and was wondering how they are coping with your decisions. I know that Lolly knew for years what Josh was about but I would guess your wives didn't have that precious time to deal with it. I don't know how I would react in a circumstance like this, but I imagine it must be hard for them. My opinion is that it wasn't only you who 'sacrificed' something when you got married even though you were gay, but they must have 'sacrificed' some dreams of their own as well when marrying you. Or am I wrong?
As a bystander here, I wanted to ask those of you who are gay and married what your wives have to say about your situations. I cannot but think that most of them didn't have that precious time of getting to know you and your situation since your teenage years as Lolly did with Josh. And since most of you keep saying that by marrying you 'sacrificed' something, I think that it must be your wives that sacrificed something, too. I cannot imagine how hard it must be to live like that and since I don't find many wives here blogging about their gay husbands, I wonder how they feel and what they had to sacrifice by excepting such a 'life style'. Just wondering…
I think Weed has actually stated that he supports everyone's DECISION (aka pro-choice) no matter what. I don't think he is trying to make a political stand in his previous posts, only a personal one – and that everyone else can take their own personal stand as well. He repeats himself over and over when he says that it's all about loving others no matter what their sexuality, beliefs, opinions, etc. – which I feel says that he supports everyone's right for happiness. Perhaps I'm a bit naive when I say things like that, but isn't that what it's all about anyway? For us all to live in peace & happiness?
Dear Josh and Lolly, I am an active Mormon, straight, married and like you I too have 3 little ones. I have to tell you that my admiration and respect for you grow by the post! Josh I absolutely LOVE your sense of humor and Lolly I LOVE your sweetness!!! I cry and laugh reading your posts!!!! You two are absolutely AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We are a military family (currently stationed on Guam), and since the military takes us all over I hope that someday it takes us close to you. It would be a pleasure and honor to meet you two in person!!!!!
My name is Méssia Fromm by the way 🙂
Someone sent me this link thinking my situation was similar to Weed's because I am a gay lds man who was married for 10 years and has three kids. The key differences being my wife didn't know, Sex with her wasn't "amazing" it was traumatic. When I finally came out to my mom she wasn't loving or supportive. She was bitter and hateful. I can't imagine what would have happened to me if I came out to her at 16 as Weed did to his parents.
Not being able to have a relationship with someone I was attracted to left me completely unfulfilled. I got crushes on guys all the time and even fell in love with men I knew. My heart wasn't in my marriage at all because I was physically incapable of being in love with my wife or any woman, just as Weed is. I wanted a man. When I finally got tired of being miserable I went looking for and found a great man who makes me enormously happy. I plan to spend the rest of my life with him, and not just because the sex is amazing. It's because he is someone I am actually in love with. He's my best friend and I think he's the best looking human being I've ever laid eyes on. He's what a significant other should be.
I think its great Weed is happy with his life and marriage. I don't think he is in love with his wife, just loves her as a close friend, which sounds pale imo. I don't have any idea how he is pulling off amazing sex. I have my doubts its truly amazing. If Weed had sex with a man he was deeply attracted to he might have to redefine his understanding of the word.
I hope other gay lds men use extreme caution if they plan to follow in Weed's footsteps. While some here claim there thousands of silent gay lds men happily married to a woman (a claim I highly doubt), there are plenty of vocal guys like me who will tell you marrying a woman was a disaster.
To me you are horrible for leaving your family for your own gratification!!!! There is something called not being selfish. I could care less Iin you felt your needs not met. But to abandon your family because of it is sick. What you say is really very sad that in today's society thr family unit is thought of as nothing over stupid sexual passions ( I am including all people who leave their spouses for sexual gratification gay or not). It just sickense what I read from you mr anon. Poor ex wife and kids.. They are going to have serious abandonment issues for sure.
Hold on…. So you kept this GIGANTIC secret from your wife, fell in love with men while you were married, left your wife and kids, and now talk about how amazing things are.
Geez. I have no idea why that marriage didn't work. My brother's wife did the same thing to him. She's not gay.
It's called LYING and CHEATING.
Der.
Of course your marriage is going to be miserable if you're not into it, lie daily to your spouse, and seek elsewhere for your happiness. Just because someone else makes it work (by being honest and open and faithful) doesn't mean they are handling things the same way or experience the same thing you did. I HIGHLY HIGHLY HIGHLY doubt your current relationship would last either if you handled it the same way you handled your marriage.
Hmmm How should I start this …. Well after reading both of the judgmental responses to the first comment above, I was thinking ..Your responses to someone like Anonymous is the same reason why men like him stay in the closet , choose to marry women , then cheat on then and realized that there married life to a woman was not what they wanted or is fulfilling to them in any sort of way.
No one is perfect here, As much as we all strive to be the " PERFECT FAMILY" we can't expect that there is not going to be mistakes along the way. If you think that the Weed's or your family are without fault, then I would think you were mistaken .
Where is your love and understanding for him, the same love and understanding that you have for Josh and his family. He is only telling his story and his opinion since he has been there.
Remember there is only one JUDGE , just something you should go back and review in THE BOOK.
If he doesnt want judgement then he shouldnt judge. His post is nothing but judgement. Here is a man (Josh Weed) who is actually being faithful to his wife, regardless of his passions (we ALL have passions) and this Mr. Anon comes in to say that he "was" miserable. Well sorry sir.. he should have thought about that before he got married. Once you get married, all bets are off. He justifies leaving his family for a sexual fulfillment with another person (in this case a man). It doesnt even matter that it was a man IMO, its the fact he completely abandoned his family because of sex. He sits there talking about who he doesn't see how Josh is happy, and that he doesnt know how he "pulls off the amazing sex with her". I don't call that loving- the comments he is making. I call that a bit judgemental. If he doesnt want to be judged he should not judge. I think him leaving his family is a bigger problem them josh staying with his family and denying his passions. PERIOD!!!
Look I am not here to win you over or be your friend. I just believe that both of the comments above are judgmental. As you can see he is clearly just telling his story of a married life that didn't work for him.
Obviously you have never walked in his shoes and know how conflicted he may have felt when leaving his family. Let's not live in denial, not everyone is going to have the perfect story like the Weed's.. The truth is there are many LDS men that have and are doing the same thing he did. I don't think it's right but everyone must be accountable for what they are doing or have done… All I am asking you is to try and rethink your approach to this subject. But I also know not everyone can be open minded. Some of us just can't see beyond the perfect box that we live in. Here is something that Josh said in his coming out post.
" 8. Should all gay people who are LDS or Christian choose to marry people of the opposite gender?
I want to make it very clear that while I have found a path that brings me profound joy and that is the right path for me, I don’t endorse this as the only path for somebody who is gay and religious. I will never, ever judge somebody else’s path as being “incorrect” and I know many people who have chosen different paths than myself. "
Remember we all have different paths and journeys in life.
I would suggest that instead of passing so much judgement on him maybe you can extend an offer of love and prayer for his family that they may find peace and forgiveness in there hearts.
In closing we are all going to be accountable for our mistakes and actions. Let our Heavenly Father take care of that, I think he knows his job pretty well.
So as you sit in church today say a prayer for all of us that happen to not be as perfect as you. PERIOD!!!
Josh, if you your story can help just one man, even just one, to take his penis out of another man's butt and put it into a woman he marries, I say job well done, my friend.
I guess I wonder why anyone would choose to be involved in any religion that doesn't agree with your true self? Choosing a religion means that one is essentially saying that they agree with the beliefs of that religion correct? So if you don't agree with them, why on earth would you remain a participating follower of that religion? I sometimes wonder if people realize that it isn't mandatory to choose a specific religion…..
your "true self" is not defined by sexual orientation. Sexual orientation is sexual feeling, not the "self", "self" is alot more then just sex you know. If I go by your rationale, my "true self" is just heterosexual. Does that even sound correct to you. That my whole existence is based of my sexual orientaton. NO it does not. Your rationale is flawed. This country was based of religious freedoms, the LDS church is not against gay's. Geez, I wish people would stop thinking that. The church believes in living a clean life- no sexual experience before marriage, no adultery during marriage, and stay away from anything that can dull the spiritual nature of us all (which can include porn crap, etc etc).
Just wanted to say that blacks and the priesthood was not doctrine, as was polygamy. There is no correlation in my book… You don't have to agree as I don't agree with how you feel about the situation- but I do know the history, and that was one thing I looked for first.. There is no and never was a why, IT JUST HAPPENED. Many church leaders just say "that's how it was," but it wasn't. It was changed by one prophet and it stayed that way. Heavenly Father never said to do it, it was just done.
I find this site nauseatingly dishonest. It is one thing for 2 individuals to love each other and even transcend their respective sexual orientations. In theory, this same beautiful commitment could occur w/ 2 men (either both straight or a gay-straight pair) or 2 women (both straight or a gay-straight pair) or even a gay man and a lesbian. While likely a rare occurrence, I think that is beautiful when it happens, a celebration of individuals' love over biological impulse.
But that is not what is going on here. Mr. Weed promotes ex-gay therapy and is motivated by a religious ideology. He would not celebrate a story of a gay man and a straight man living out a comparable scenario. It is also clear from the comments that this is not about the celebration of the love of 2 individuals but rather just another barrage in the culture war. Note the commenters' references to "SSA" (a term used by the ex-gay movement to medicalize gay love) and to the "homosexual lifestyle."
Go and live your life as you wish Mr. Weed. But don't think your "this is just about me and Lolly" routine is fooling anyone. Please take a look at the Anonymous comment at June 14 at 6:08. This is what you wrought by intent. You are responsible for all the pain that results.
Rubbish!! That all I have to say to this poster Jere…. There is some paranoia going on here. HAHA. This man and his wife are authentic!!
Josh – I admire your honesty and openness. I hope more Christians can learn from your example – that being gay is not a choice and there is nothing wrong with whatever lifestyle you choose.
I distinctly remember learning what gay meant. I was six years old and I had overheard my dad tell someone that we had friends who were coming to visit from Vancouver, BC, and they were gay. When we left the room, I asked my dad what gay meant. He said "Oh, it's like when a woman would rather be married to another woman. Or a man would rather be married to another man." It seemed simple-enough to me then and it still does. I think there is no right age to tell kids what it means to be gay, but if they grow up thinking it's okay, they likely will still think it's okay when they are adults.
Earlier this week much of the LGBT blogosphere and the mainstream media talked about Josh Weed, the "happily married" gay Mormon who claims while he's completely homosexual, he has a satisfying marriage with a woman with whom he has a "robust sex life." But as it turns out, Weed is actually an anti-gay "reparative therapist" who gets paid to torture gay men about their completely natural sexual orientation. Some of you may want to rethink the kind words you said about this motherfucker on Monday's blog post. (Tipped by JMG reader Gilberto)
From: Joe My God..Please tell me that you ARE NOT associated with LifeStar??
Labels: "ex-gay", assholery, douchenozzles, religion
WOW, Margie is spreading some serious allegations, which is completely faults. Of course there will be people like you who don't like seeing a good family post something that is trully amazing, IMHO.
Margie that is my brother your talking about. You obviously do not know him.
Do you care to address the information on your Lifestar profile?
http://www.lifestarwashington.com/staff.php
From the description it sounds as if you were involved in reparative therapy. At the very least, you a clearly supportive of "combatting" "unwanted sexual attractions".
By the way, therapist is misspelled on that profile.
Thank you for these posts. Although I am straight (as is my husband), I have been helped by your initial post where you spoke about intimacy being more than just physical attraction. I needed that reminded. When sex is done right it is about communing with your spouse and God. Thank you, thank you, for that tender reminder. I hope others, especially teens, read your post and pick up on this key point, too. You're helping make the world a better place!
The perfect time may not come. Maybe you didn't really mean perfect, but it is probably not a good idea to wait for the magic time, perfect in setting, feeling right. Maybe feeling right is good enough – one out of three.
Thanks for sharing though. It's a life changer for many people, not just you two (soon five).
I LOVE you! I can relate to you so much! I laugh so hard reading your posts because I am also all over the place. I'm definitely gonna be reading more often now!
The only people praising you are Mormons. You're pathetic.
Which means that Mormons are pathetic?
Well, I'm pathetic, thank you very much.
Josh and Lolly-
Thank you for your beautiful testimony to your love and faith. I felt your joy, and was reminded of the intimacy and trust that makes my own relationship promising.
I'm so sorry that you have had to endure hateful and hurtful comments. Nobody should experience being spoken to in the way you have been spoken to in some of these comments. Nobody can truly apologize on behalf of others, but as an LGBTQ person, I am sorry that fellow LGBTQ people have not extended to you the same tolerance they wish to have extended to them. There are jerks in every group of people.
I say that half-joking, because I know that below the surface of jerky behavior is usually a deeply injured child of God. I hope you can understand the deep, paralyzing fear that LGBTQ people have that the people and churches they love will try to use your post to push us back into marriages that haven't worked for them the way yours has for you. I hope you can understand this, not only so that you might be better prepared to deal with how your post will be used politically, but also so that you might be able to take those hurtful comments less seriously.
My other wish is that all those who have read your story with open hearts might read other love stories with equally open hearts-love stories of same-gender couples who love each other (and sometimes children) with the deep and tender respect you two do, and have found fulfillment and deep connection to God in LGBTQ affirming churches and communities of faith.
As a Lutheran pastor, I care for people whose faith has been devastated by the failed attempts at marriages such as yours, and by things "loving christians" have told them. And, although I lack your eloquence to tell their stories, I have seen their lives and loves flourish as they reconcile their sexual orientation and gender identity with their faith. I am glad your story is being told, but also feeling protective of those being driven to not only suicide but also atheism by the things our churches have done with stories such as yours.
I hope you keep writing about your story, because I would love to learn more about how this unfolds for you. I also hope you keep writing about the mundane and miraculous moments of raising a family, because your love and opennness to your children does the world good. Plus, I need a belly laugh, and the bambi-nuggets conversation was the funniest thing I've read in a long time!
May the God who we both worship keeped you wrapped in love!
Lura
As a bystander here, I wanted to ask those of you who are gay and married what your wives have to say about your situations. I cannot but think that most of them didn't have that precious time of getting to know you and your situation since your teenage years as Lolly did with Josh. And since most of you keep saying that by marrying you 'sacrificed' something, I think that it must be your wives also that sacrificed something, too. I cannot imagine how hard it must be to live like that and since I don't find many wives here blogging about their gay husbands, I wonder how they feel and what they had to sacrifice by excepting such a 'life style'. Just wondering.
I can't help but find it remarkable that some of the same people who feel that it's sad that you've denied yourself the "fullness" of the experience of a same-sex relationship would most likely not feel that you were missing out on anything at all if you bounced from one relationship to the next, as long as they were homosexual ones. I notice some of them make reference to "all of the wonderful relationships" they've experienced living in the "honesty" of their sexual identity. It doesn't seem to occur to them that they've chosen something less than complete in forgoing the deep commitment, trust, and union of monogamy and marriage. It very much seems like they see one's sexual identity and activity as the paramount measure of their identity as a person and as a partner in a relationship.
And yes, I realize that there are gay people in committed long-term unions. It's just that I've noticed that there are a lot of people who take a very "liberated" view of sexuality in general and believe that sexual restraint represents a loss to the individual, not realizing that substituting sexual promiscuity for sexual fidelity means forfeiting many good things, also.
I am not naive enough to believe that what you, Josh and Lolly, have created together can be duplicated by everyone with SSA. Obviously there is a steep failure rate of marriages like yours, but then again, so many people bail on marriage anyway when the going gets rough. You walked into your marriage completely cognizant that this was what you were facing together, and viewing marriage as permanent and divorce not an option.
I will be honest: if my husband looked at me without desire, I don't know if I could handle it. I don't really understand the nature of your physical relationship with each other, and I don't need to, really, since I'm in a physically and emotionally fulfilling, fully-hetero marriage. But if I were gay and considering entering into a heterosexual marriage, and trying to understand and appraise your situation to figure out if I could make it work for me, I would want to know what you feel when you get into bed together. Not trying to be nosy, just frank, and you've certainly been that, so I'm sure you understand. 🙂
I am pleasantly surprised by the support you've received from gay people in these comment threads. I totally expected hostility- not from LDS or Christians, as some apparently expected- but from gay men and women who would object to the idea that you eschewed a homosexual lifestyle as a moral wrong and chose a heterosexual lifestyle as a moral good, and that, by your example you were encouraging others to do so. I'm just really glad that some people- even gay people- understand that not every person with same-sex attraction is happy with, or able to reconcile themselves with, living a gay lifestyle. It seems terribly unfair that society has decided that gay people must "be who they are" in terms of sexuality even if they don't want to be or act on those impulses, and ironic that at the same time it advocates people going through extensive surgeries and therapies to transform their bodies into the opposite gender when they don't like the skin they're in. The fact that unhappily gay (<–kind of ironic phrasing, heh) people have few resources or advocates in the gay community, that they have so little support in addressing SSA as a problem even when they see it as one, is another reason gay teens commit suicide. So the way I see it, for those who are content to live a gay lifestyle, your experience has little or no significance. But for those who aren't, your story offers them hope that they can live in a way that is true to who they are as a WHOLE person, not just as a sexual one.
Plus, I've gained a lot of understanding just from reading these few blog posts. And you're hilarious. 🙂 Rock on, Weeds!
Beautiful answer to the question.